party wall act

Postby andrew54 » Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:55 pm

Yes, Billy, write a polite letter to the neighbour, another to the builder, and another to the planning 'agent' if there is one. Send them each a copy of the PWA booklet. Many builders never use the act, they simply don't bother.

Measurements on plans are usually the outside of the WALL. They can only put foundations under your land if they use the PWA, but please remember that the builder might not know that.

Yes it is your back yard to do what you like with. Unfortunatly your neighbour feels the same way about HIS back yard.
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Postby Corby-Billy » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:27 pm

andrew54 wrote:Yes, Billy, write a polite letter to the neighbour, another to the builder, and another to the planning 'agent' if there is one. Send them each a copy of the PWA booklet. Many builders never use the act, they simply don't bother.

Measurements on plans are usually the outside of the WALL. They can only put foundations under your land if they use the PWA, but please remember that the builder might not know that.

Yes it is your back yard to do what you like with. Unfortunatly your neighbour feels the same way about HIS back yard.


Cheers Andrew
Good info
I would have assumed that the meaurements are to outside face of wall
& glad you have confirmed this.
I originally quoted the wrong size as it's 2.3m on the drawing & not 2.7m
the distance between their existing wall & tight too the fence is 2.3M

Can only thank everyone for the advice
like an idiot i payed too much attention to everyone who said they'd never get permission & that included the woman in the Planning office
at the time and then after time thought no more of it!
:oops:
Now i'm 18 months behind with work about to start inside the next 6-8 weeks
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Postby despair » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:50 pm

Well if the plans say 2.3metres and the actual space from wall to fence is only 2.3 metres then both the footings and the soffits and fascias and guttering will trespass onto your land .............you can SUE FOR TRESPASS

The plans should ONLY specify 2.10 metres if the foundation oversite and soffits and fascias remain within their land

The neighbour is a bloody idiot if he think he can ever park a car in a garage 2.10 metre wide .......even garage doors wont fit the width left after the piers either side are built

Even 2.3 metres is not wide enough for a garage or a standard garage door

You need to be onto this lot FAST or your fence and your patio will be ripped up
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Postby Alan Harris » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:41 pm

Dear All

The party wall act does have clout, but only if the unnotified party has losses to be recovered as a consequence of the work which was undertaken but not notified. An injunction which is sought can be very expensive for the party who did not notify the neighbour of the the work. The last time a notice was not issued in my experience the offending party ended up with a bill for nearly £10,000. Do not forget that when an offended party appoints a surveyor the offending party can also end up paying high surveyors fees as well as the legal costs.

It is only good practice to inform a neighbour when you are doing work which involves undermining or affecting the neighbour's land or buildings. The Act simply enforces building owners to advise the neighbours under a legal framework which defines how much information has to be provided.

If you ignore The Act do not be surprised to get a bill for it.

best regards


Alan Harris
Alan is a consulting engineer specialising in subsidence, tree roots, soils and party wall surveying.
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Postby Corby-Billy » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:57 pm

Alan Harris wrote:Dear All

The party wall act does have clout, but only if the unnotified party has losses to be recovered as a consequence of the work which was undertaken but not notified. An injunction which is sought can be very expensive for the party who did not notify the neighbour of the the work. The last time a notice was not issued in my experience the offending party ended up with a bill for nearly £10,000. Do not forget that when an offended party appoints a surveyor the offending party can also end up paying high surveyors fees as well as the legal costs.

It is only good practice to inform a neighbour when you are doing work which involves undermining or affecting the neighbour's land or buildings. The Act simply enforces building owners to advise the neighbours under a legal framework which defines how much information has to be provided.

If you ignore The Act do not be surprised to get a bill for it.

best regards


Alan Harris


That is very interesting Alan
All i know so far is a 2 storey extension is going up starting in the next 6-8 weeks
How they are going to build it & how they are going to ensure our saftey etc or how they are going to dig etc i have absolutely no idea.
We have a letter of apology about probable inconvenience etc but no more
If have just finished writing a letter for them which is not in anyway nasty & have asked if they are aware of the PWA regarding their planned extension
Last edited by Corby-Billy on Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Corby-Billy » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:03 pm

despair wrote:Well if the plans say 2.3metres and the actual space from wall to fence is only 2.3 metres then both the footings and the soffits and fascias and guttering will trespass onto your land .............you can SUE FOR TRESPASS

The plans should ONLY specify 2.10 metres if the foundation oversite and soffits and fascias remain within their land

The neighbour is a bloody idiot if he think he can ever park a car in a garage 2.10 metre wide .......even garage doors wont fit the width left after the piers either side are built

Even 2.3 metres is not wide enough for a garage or a standard garage door

You need to be onto this lot FAST or your fence and your patio will be ripped up


Sorry despair about not being clear
Imagine a normal garage at the front with a square utility room at the rear of it
Take the boundary line part of the utily room & angle it back to the bottom end is only 2.3M
The length of the utility room wall that will meet the fence is 3.7M starting at 2.3m & widening to 4.3m
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Postby despair » Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:05 pm

One devious thought :---------

They may well be unaware of the PWA which would allow them to place foundations under your side

If you do not mention the PWA they CANNOT remove your fence or put foundations under your land thus they have to do everything totally within their land

This might be to your advantage

THINK IT THROUGH
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Postby Corby-Billy » Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:37 pm

despair wrote:One devious thought :---------

They may well be unaware of the PWA which would allow them to place foundations under your side

If you do not mention the PWA they CANNOT remove your fence or put foundations under your land thus they have to do everything totally within their land

This might be to your advantage

THINK IT THROUGH


We notified them at the start we will not allow them to take any part of the fence down
This was the stage when we told them we are objecting. Laws or no laws i don't take too kindly to having my life disrupted

On the laws of this land it's worth remembering that Peado's are legally living next to schools.

Much like our planning Laws it doesn't make them right

I have no real problem with mentioning this PWA to them Despair

My annoyance is with which ever bunch of clowns sit around a table & draught up crap !

Never in my chuff have i heard anything as ridiculous as a Council approving planning but take no responsibility there on in

That's like me planning a weeks production. Getting it totally wrong but it's nothing to with me

When approving Planning they should be made totally responsible to see it through to completion IMO

The fact they don't says to me they are a waste of a salary

The ones that write stupid laws are worth even less
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Postby despair » Mon Apr 07, 2008 9:51 pm

yeah a bunch od MPs who wangle every last penny of expenses to buy 2nd homes and feed all and sundry at our expense

Did you see the latest ones who while only living 9 miles from Westminster have claimed every penny of the £23,000 allowance to buy a flat in London

All on our hard earnt taxes
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Postby Corby-Billy » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:17 pm

despair wrote:yeah a bunch od MPs who wangle every last penny of expenses to buy 2nd homes and feed all and sundry at our expense

Did you see the latest ones who while only living 9 miles from Westminster have claimed every penny of the £23,000 allowance to buy a flat in London

All on our hard earnt taxes


Someone of my own heart Despair
:lol: :lol:

Blair claimed his TV license. Alledgedly
Nuff said

Reminds of the neighbour

They do these things because they can

This is the same pair that wanted a parking restriction just for them because they couldn't fit their 2 cars 3ft from their gate
:lol: :lol:
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Postby andrew54 » Tue Apr 08, 2008 9:26 am

The PWA enables neighbours to put their foundations under your land. I wonder what the legal siuation is if these neighbours find deep fence posts in their way, as deep as the foundations.
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Postby despair » Tue Apr 08, 2008 9:38 am

It realy is unbelievable that someone could invent the PWA and allow anothers foundations to be under your land since this will stop you installing a fence or growing what you like on your own land

Its utter and total madness
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Postby Alan Harris » Tue Apr 08, 2008 9:55 am

Dear Despair

The reason is that walls will not remain stable if they are resting on one edge of the foundation - the wind would blow them over easily and the soil would fail because of th uneven stress across the underside of the asymmetric foundation. It would be ridiculous to build a garden wall on piles when the object of a wall is to act as a boundary. Why would one normally wish to install a fence on a boundary when the neighbour has already built a wall? Under the PW Act the surveyors would agree a reasonable compromise which if absolutely necessary would provide holes for fence posts! Neighbours have to talk and if they cannot then surveyors have to talk for them!

best regards


Alan Harris
Alan is a consulting engineer specialising in subsidence, tree roots, soils and party wall surveying.
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Postby despair » Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:06 am

alan

i am not stupid and know the reasons for the oversite to foundations

i am also not talking about garden walls

i am talking about neighbours wanting to build 2 storey extentions with thw wall slam up to the boundary ............the oversite of foundations becomes a trespass as would soffits/fascias and gutters

equally its well nigh impossible to grow anything in the few inches of soil above those foundations

when the wall also blocks all the sunlight etc you previosly enjoyed in that area and ruins your peacable enjoyment of your property then its a travesty
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Postby hzatph » Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:06 am

Foundations are permitted by law. Gutters, soffits etc are not explicitly permitted and are therefore a trespass and actionable as such. That is the difference and I am sure that was deliberate for sound reasons. Sometimes this works for one's benefit and sometimes for one's detriment.

The fundamental problem is that we all like out light, air and space ... but there are a lot of us so things are rather crowded so the actions of one party impact upon their neighbours.

There are lots of things I woudl like to do, like terminate my neighbour's easments and right of way on the grounds of bad behaviour and total townie type lack of care of their land ... but I can't.
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