Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mine!

Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby gablewallhell » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:31 pm

Hi Rose

I am no expert like others on here, but here is my two penneth worth.

By involving the council you have drawn their attention to this tree. Any dealing with councils, planning, council tree people etc, is a hiding to nothing and you will not resolve your issue, IMHO and from experience.

Can I ask if you removed it and replaced it with a new one (that you are not allergic to), would anyone "report you" to the council. If not, my advice is just to remove and replace tree.

If you think you will be "reported" you are allowed to (as I understand from this forum) to remove any branches to your boundary, so do that.

In relation to who owns the land, if its not yours, it's the developers, but they have managed to wangle a deal where they don't have to maintain it after 10 years. The developers on my estate bought a plot, but fencing to the very edge of boundary was awkward with trees and a stream, so a fence went up leaving a slither of land. This slither is not on my deeds (I am one of a dozen houses adjacent to it). It is still owned by the developers despite the fact that they don't maintain it. It is often just assumed that these bits of land are council owned and they are not.

Best of luck.

Mark
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby gablewallhell » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:31 pm

Hi Rose

I am no expert like others on here, but here is my two penneth worth.

By involving the council you have drawn their attention to this tree. Any dealing with councils, planning, council tree people etc, is a hiding to nothing and you will not resolve your issue, IMHO and from experience.

Can I ask if you removed it and replaced it with a new one (that you are not allergic to), would anyone "report you" to the council. If not, my advice is just to remove and replace tree.

If you think you will be "reported" you are allowed to (as I understand from this forum) to remove any branches to your boundary, so do that.

In relation to who owns the land, if its not yours, it's the developers, but they have managed to wangle a deal where they don't have to maintain it after 10 years. The developers on my estate bought a plot, but fencing to the very edge of boundary was awkward with trees and a stream, so a fence went up leaving a slither of land. This slither is not on my deeds (I am one of a dozen houses adjacent to it). It is still owned by the developers despite the fact that they don't maintain it. It is often just assumed that these bits of land are council owned and they are not.

Best of luck.

Mark
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby gablewallhell » Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:32 pm

oops must have pressed submit twice :oops: Sorry!
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby jonahinoz » Fri Sep 05, 2014 5:02 pm

In relation to who owns the land, if its not yours, it's the developers,

Hi,

In which case, a visit to Land Registry where you can point to the bit of land in question, should resolve ownership. If it belongs to the developers, make them an offer to buy the land the tree is standing on.

Can a tree that causes an allergic reaction be considered a nuisance? If not, it could be a ploy for getting rid of NFH ... if they are allergic.

I assume the tree is now too big to be unprotected? How is that determined? Memory says something about trunk diameter at a specified height,

John W
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby APC » Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:42 pm

jonahinoz wrote:In relation to who owns the land, if its not yours, it's the developers,

Hi,

In which case, a visit to Land Registry where you can point to the bit of land in question, should resolve ownership. If it belongs to the developers, make them an offer to buy the land the tree is standing on.

Can a tree that causes an allergic reaction be considered a nuisance? If not, it could be a ploy for getting rid of NFH ... if they are allergic.

I assume the tree is now too big to be unprotected? How is that determined? Memory says something about trunk diameter at a specified height,

John W


Allergic reactions are not considered a nuisance.

Trees are not automatically protected at a certain size, but trees within conservation areas may be protected if their stem diameter at breast height is 7.5cm or more.
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby RoseRodent » Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:12 pm

MacadamB53 wrote:Hi Rose,

There is a very definite red line around the bit where the tree sits, a little notch cut from the end of my drive and the end of the neighbour's path and the marking "public open space"

SE BDY adj back of footway & public open space


so your SE boundary abuts the footpath and a "public open space" and the plan has the area with the tree marked as "public open space"?

if I've got that much right then it's pretty clear you don't own the tree.

was the grass cutting meeting held because the council aren't mowing the grass anymore?

have you checked the list of public roads to make sure it's not just heresay?

Kind regards, Mac


Hi, yes I have checked the register and it says [my road] from [abutting road at north end] to [abutting road at south end]: Carriageways & adjacent footways are adopted for maintenance. There is no metion in the register of these spaces, but I also checked the register for some roads where they perform this maintenance and the text is identical.

Yes, the grass cutting meeting was because the council has stopped mowing these areas, they said they had a contract to maintain it for 10 years. I don't know if they can own it without a duty of maintenance of if that means they don't own it. Spectacularly, my answer which finally came from "Planning:Trees" is that the council is not sure whose tree it is, but in good news it has no TPO and is not a conservation area, so I can start cutting anything which overhangs at last.

If it belongs to the council, there is a very detailed policy about them not removing any trees for various reasons, including harbouring pests and pollen nuisances, so it will be staying.

Will anyone report me if I do something to it - I really have no idea! Since I will be hiring someone to do the work, I'm not sure if anyone will realise that it's not in fact the council who is doing it, they'll only see someone arrive, ask me to move my car and then start cutting at the tree. So I guess on to the land registry to see who does in fact own the tree so I can negotiate with them. Sometimes I do wonder if trying to do the right thing is a hiding to nothing. I could write and say that I will be cutting the overhang leaving a nasty-looking lopsided tree or I can arrange to have the tree cut in a nice shape which will include cutting some of their side also here's 10 days to object or I'll go ahead, but then that could attract all kinds of tree inspectors to a tree they didn't previously give a toss about! Act without giving notice and there is the risk they will try to drag me to court for damages. Doubt they'd get much, since the "visual amenity" of the tree is not actually enjoyed by the owners (whoever they are) as they don't live here, so their damages in losing part of the size of the tree would have to be severely limited, I'd have thought. I could always send that notice to their email inbox, the tree would be well and truly cut by the time they get to it, and I can validly claim that I made the effort. :twisted:

Would be nice if it turns out to belong to the developers, they might well sell it to me.

Thanks for the help :D
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby mugwump » Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:21 pm

IMHO

The little triangle still belongs to the developer.

I think what has happened is that the developer awarded the maintenance contract to the council for 10 years at the start of the development. The intention possibly being that at the end of the 10 years then all the houses are built and occupied and some sort of Residents' Committee will take over the maintenance of the public/communal areas. However this last bit has never occurred so the triangle is now not officially maintained by anyone hence the meeting about grass cutting.

I think that the tree can be treated no different to your neighbours tree that overhangs your garden and causes a nuisance.
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby MacadamB53 » Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:10 pm

Hi Rose,

Will anyone report me if I do something to it?

report you to who? only the landowner would have something to say about it ;)

Happy felling, Mac
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby arborlad » Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:43 pm

RoseRodent wrote:........... the issue is with maintenance of this tree. I have a much larger species of tree (cherry blossom) than anyone else,



Cherrys don't respond well to being cut back, usually results in a lot of dieback.
arborlad

smile...it confuses people
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby oorya » Thu Sep 11, 2014 1:30 pm

RoseRodent wrote:
Spectacularly, my answer which finally came from "Planning:Trees" is that the council is not sure whose tree it is, but in good news it has no TPO and is not a conservation area, so I can start cutting anything which overhangs at last.

If it belongs to the council, there is a very detailed policy about them not removing any trees for various reasons, including harbouring pests and pollen nuisances, so it will be staying.



I may be missing something here but if the council say they don't know who owns it, then surely they don't own it themselves, so why not fell the whole tree.
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Re: Tree - not on my property but somehow mine... and not mi

Postby Roblewis » Thu Sep 11, 2014 4:33 pm

Accidently of course while checking your chainsaw :D :D :D
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