Family disagreement re Care Home funding - advice needed

A discussion forum for the elderly, their carers and advisers

Postby Miss Marple » Thu Dec 22, 2005 12:14 am

Pennyfarthing,

That's a wonderful post to have read. It shows that at least a couple of them at the DWP have a heart.

God bless your Mum and Dad and the DWP!

And I'm sure, from your posts, that your Mum and Dad will use that money very, very wisely.
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Postby Puzzled » Mon Jan 02, 2006 2:32 pm

Hi everyone, and happy new year to all.

Just a quick update, Dad arranged for his wife to have 3 weeks "interim care" in a care home of her choice (which he paid for). When my step-mother was due to be discharged from hospital, the social worker dealing with their "plight" was extremely helpful. I was fortunately visiting at the time, so was invited to sit in on the discussions. The social worker offered my step-mother up to 4 weeks interim care as a transitional period from hospital to home. This would have been funded by the state, but obviously there were only selected care homes available who had the "interim beds" available. Dad did not want her to go into a home that she may not be happy with (some of them we have looked at are "flea-pits") so he made the decision to pay privately for a very nice one that was within walking distance from their home. He has been able to visit every day, but has on occasions had to be quite firm when he wanted to leave as I think his wife would have had him stay from 10am through to 10pm - almost as exhausting as looking after her at home!

My step-mother is due to come home mid-week and social services have arranged for a carer to attend daily to help with washing/dressing, and a couple of days at a daycare centre for her. Hopefully this will be enough help for dad to continue with but we will have to monitor the situation. All this help also has to be paid for (I think it's something like £12.50 per hour for help in the home, and the daycare centre is something like £15 per day. Still quite a lot to find every week!

We are hoping that dad will let us know if things get on top of him again, and hopefully not leave it until things are at breaking point next time. I have to say that his general well-being and state of mind has improved dramatically since she has been in the care home, and he now realises (he tells us) just how bad he was feeling. Unfortunately as in a lot of situations, you don't always realise how bad things have crept up on you, until you find out just how "well" you feel when you are removed from the situation, or indeed recover from a period of illness etc.

Pennyfarthing, thankyou particularly for your input re the carers allowance. Dad has an "assessor" coming round to do a financial assessment - they will decide if he has to pay full whack for the services or if they qualify for any help. We anticipate that he won't be entitled to any financial help because of their savings etc, but the good thing is that the assessor is qualified to give advice for benefits so dad has instructions to ask for either the carers allowance or indeed attendance allowance (in his own right), whichever is the most beneficial to him or whichever he is entitled to. Hopefully my sister is going to be able to be present at this time, so she will be able to prompt him.

Thanks again for all your input on this post and I will update you all again in the weeks/months to come. Fingers crossed that we have no more major dramas.

Regards, Puzzled
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Postby despair » Mon Jan 02, 2006 4:57 pm

I hope your parents homes deeds are written at joint tenants in common

because then Social services can only put a lien on half of the house to fund care home etc in future

You would be well advised to go to CAB and find out all the inticacies of things because the Social services and the state plundering of assets/savings for long term care is nothing short of bare faced robbery
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Postby Pennyfarthing » Wed Mar 22, 2006 11:33 pm

Hi Puzzled - just wondering how things are going?

Some cheerful news from me - I posted just before Xmas that my parents had received wonderful help from the Pensions Dept. Well this week they had their Council Tax bill and its over a £1000 and thanks to this guy they don't have to pay a penny!! They are still in shock because they have paid their way all their lives and never claimed any benefits.

It is lovely to see their faces!! :) :)
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Postby Puzzled » Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:23 am

Hi Pennyfarthing,

Thank you for your interest. We have had a bit of a torrid time this New Year. My step-mother agreed to go into a carehome of her choice for 3 weeks over xmas (funded privately by my father from his personal resources). This was to facilitate her release from hospital, and also in the hope that she would like being looked after, and may want to stay. Alas, no such luck, she found fault in everything and everyone. Gave my dad a very hard time, demanding that he be in attendance to her at the care home from virtually 10 am - 10 pm everyday. Needless to say, he did not get the well-deserved rest he needed.

At the end of the three weeks, dad said he would have her back home, daily care was put in place to help him cope. To cut a long story short, she continued making life v.difficult for him, and became increasingly abusive, both physically and verballyl. In the end, we had to almost rescue him, social services said we needed to part them for their own safety. The other side of the family put pressure on dad all the time, playing on his sense of duty, so it ended up in a case conference with social services, and unfortunately for us, dad said that he wanted to try and continue to look after his wife, so long as she stayed calm!

So, they have been reunited, with care and support in place. So far, things have stayed relatively calm and he appears to be coping. We think that our step-mother's daughters had said to her that they could not have her, so unless she went back to dad and behaved herself she would end up in a home. It appears to have been a bit of a wake up call, and as I said, so far so good. Although we do suspect that dad won't tell us about things again, unless it gets unbearable, as he feels he opened up "pandora's box", then couldn't close it again.

I do worry about him. On a good note though, I did manage to get him to apply for attendance allowance for him (in his own right). Unfortunately, their pension man didn't seem anywhere near as good as the chap looking after your parents. We are still waiting to hear if he has qualified for it. I was told that the "carers allowance" was only payable to people under 65, so he would not be eligible.

I do feel sorry in a way for my step-mother as her body is letting her down and she is very bitter/unhappy about it. But to take it out on dad to these extremes is unforgivable. And the fact that she CAN control her behaviour, makes it even more unacceptable. However, you cannot tell your dad what to do, he has to make his own decisions, and we will be here to pick up the pieces, when it all falls apart.

I am absolutelyl positive that the views and reactions of the step-family is purely monetary based! They have issued veiled threats that if their mother has to go into a home, or our dad leaves her, dad would have to sell HIS flat to give them her half. It is such a shame that after 15 years of having their own assets, dad agreed to put her on the deeds to this latest property (she had constantly nagged him to do it ever since they got married, saying that if anything happened to him, we would chuck her out). We would NEVER have dreamed of it before. But now we know exactly what she is like - well, all I can say .... ????!!!!

Poor old dad, it's not that any of us need his modest estate when he goes, and to be frank, I would rather he spent it all before he went. It just really makes you sick, when someone that was supposed to love my dad can behave in such a manner. Even more sickening is if he goes first, her daughters will get everything that my dad has spent his whole life building up.

Oh well, better end now. Bet you wished you had'nt asked now eh??? :lol: :lol:

Thanks for listening.
Puzzled
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Postby despair » Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:06 pm

Why not explain all that to your father and ask that he makes proper provision .........he can put the house in trust with 50% going to either side or he could probably arrange to retrieve the half he put in step mothers name

If he makes the property joint tenants in common then she cant get access to his 50% and neither can social services

Your father needs to see a really good trust solicitor now for everyones sake
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Postby Puzzled » Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:15 pm

Thanks despair, yes I agree with you 100%. Unfortunately, dad just doesn't have the energy to deal with any more conflict. He just wants an easy life, and if he wants to change the deeds back into his name, he can only do this with his wife's knowledge/co-operation. The property is now in joint tenancy, and cannot even be changed to tenants in commom without what we anticipate as a lot of grief from the other side of the family. We just don't want to add to his stress by putting pressure on him to sort it out. After all, we're not talking about a lot of money, perhaps £75,000 - £100,000, and he won't need it if he goes first. However, is she goes first, then it will all revert back to him regardless.

One point though, I did think that the state could not take anything from the property for nursing/care home fees if one of the couple are still living in it. Am I misinformed on that?
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Postby despair » Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:25 pm

I think you will find they can still place a charge on 50 % of the house

The other side of the family have got a bloody cheek
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Postby gardenlaw » Mon Mar 27, 2006 9:09 am

What the local authority cannot do is force a sale of the house whilst your father is living there. At present I think it is very arguable that a half share of the house is worth nothing and should be disregarded.
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Postby Puzzled » Tue Mar 28, 2006 3:08 pm

Thank you gardenlaw, that put's my mind at rest. I had visions of my dad being forced to sell at some stage. So long as he can remain in his home for as long as he wishes, then that is the main thing.
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Care Home Funding advice

Postby Gavlar » Sat Sep 26, 2009 9:15 am

Care home funding can be difficult to understand. I found the information on Compare Care Homes website very helpful indeed and, more importantly, up to date. Below is a like directly to that funding advice:

http://www.comparecarehomes.com/care-advice-funding.asp
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Postby Clifford Pope » Mon Oct 19, 2009 12:53 pm

This from the Direct gov website:

"The weekly rate is £53.10. This is reduced by the amount of certain other benefits, including State Pension, that you receive. If you receive certain other benefits at £53.10 or more a week, Carer's Allowance cannot be paid to you as well."
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Postby DELETED » Mon Oct 26, 2009 10:02 am

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Postby RechardSmith » Wed Mar 31, 2010 2:11 pm

Hi I read your post I like it and I am totally agree with you, your father will definitely not able to fight with these situations .Anyways good luck for you.

Best Regards ,
Free legal support service :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Postby AlexPitson » Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:46 am

It's an wonderful post.It's good to know that your parents are again back. Keep writing lovely post.Thanks for sharing with us. :lol: :lol:

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