What is a garden?

Let everyone have the same pleasure as you derive from your garden -- or perhaps a friends garden

What is a garden?

Postby Darren Reynolds » Fri Apr 22, 2011 12:55 pm

I live in a rural location. My home has a small lawn and a border and I'd like to grow some fruit and vegetables. The trouble is, there isn't really the room without detracting from the current pleasant appearance of the property. I'd have to fill the patio with boxes, or dig up the lawn. There's also nowhere to put a greenhouse that isn't either in the shade or in the middle of the lawn.

Now, adjoining my home is farmland used for grazing. I'd like to buy about 200 square metres from the farmer and I think I can talk him into that. The land is not ideal for most plants, being quite wet, on a slope, and fairly high up, but I'm prepared to build raised beds and use cloches and the like. I think I can make a go of it.

Obviously, that land is presently used for agricultural purposes - it's full of sheep and/or cattle.

What I am struggling to understand is, when is growing fruit and vegetables agricultural use, which the land already has permission for, and when is it a garden, which appears to require planning permission?

I'm fairly sure planning permission would be refused (councils are like that when farmland is involved) so I need to make sure that what I do is agriculture.

Help!
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby Twisty » Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:00 am

Hi - we have a very similar situation and are currently at the conveyancing stage of buying a small strip of land from the land owner of the field adjacent to our house. We did a pre-planning advice request for change of use from agricultural to domestic garden and it came back that we would be highly unlikely to get planning permission.

So - it will have to stay as agricultural land and we'd like to know exactly what we are allowed to grow. Have searched online and can't seem to find a definitive answer. We will get in touch with the council but if anyone has been through this process and can shed some light on what is OK to grow I'd be most grateful. Thank you very much.
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby despair » Wed Jun 01, 2011 6:12 pm

you can certainly plant an orchard and should be able to grow veg even keep chickens or goats or sheep but often putting any kind of structure like a greenhouse or shed is taboo .....................what you cannot do is incorporate it with your garden it must always remain a separate piece of land
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby Twisty » Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:18 am

Thank you very much for you reply - growing some fruit trees would be a great alternative to garden. Do you know if there has to be an identifiable boundary between the garden and agricultural land that we will soon own - e.g a dividing fence? The land is approx 1.8m x 30m. Does anybody know where we can find out what the actual law is on this? Many thanks.
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby despair » Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:46 am

"what you cannot do is incorporate it with your garden " how much clearer can it be !!!

That means it must be separated
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby border collie » Thu Jun 02, 2011 10:25 am

I am a bit puzzled by this. Why would a piece of agricultural land have to be fenced? There are many thousands of acres unfenced in the uk.

And I didn't think anyone could be forced to fence their own garden.

It is only the USE of agricultural land that is subject to planning laws.


I am not disputing it, just wondering.

To the OP, if you wanted them to be separate but not fenced you could plant a line of mixed hedging or sloe bushes etc. with a gap in to walk through.
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby RUHEAP » Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:09 am

a garden in my case is a place where over 11 years 100 tons plus of fly tipping of every conceivable type of solid and toxic liquid is deposited...where all the local fly tippers around the area know where free fly tipping is available...its far cheaper than the council tip...the council find it cheaper also..the do not have to employ staff to take care of it...why do that when you can use a crippled old age pensioner living on a limited budget to remove it all.... it only costs the council a simple stamp and very simple threat...saying move it or else,,,,the council run a beautiful country park place on my rear boundary..a bar, tennis court ,playing fields all the lot....and a free tip...just throw all your stinking kitchen waste rubbish bags over the fence onto my garden..and save council bills & increase the rat population in my garden...of course the value of my property &garden is zero of course..who wants a garden which is the local free tip for all to use.. surprised the council rubbish men don't tip the rubbish van on my garden..save council costs totally......mind you the time will come when the toxic liquid that has soaked into my garden which is a local water catchment area...runs all the way down through the town to the water treatment farm 2 miles away...then we will start to see strange happenings in the newly born..but that will be long after i am gone....my garden will still be a free tip for ever...my next door neighbour who has a fenced and gated garden sitting as a block of land in my garden with a row access...officially announced at a meeting he had authorised unlimited free tipping on my garden..... who cares if he did.... it just save money,..for everybody else....my last bill fro removing the latest fly tipping from my garden 2 weeks ago £1765...where flowers should grow rats run around..
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Re: What is a garden?

Postby Conveyancer » Thu Aug 04, 2011 6:12 pm

border collie wrote:I am a bit puzzled by this. Why would a piece of agricultural land have to be fenced? There are many thousands of acres unfenced in the uk.


I think the point is that whilst separation is not essential, it is going to be the case for planning purposes that if it looks like part of the garden it will be part of the garden. Simply using land for growing food plants is not going to make it agricultural - a vegetable patch is a vegetable patch.

Property owners cannot have it both ways. If they want to argue that what looks like garden is part of the curtilage for planning purposes when they want to put up a garage, they cannot also argue that what looks like garden is not part of the curtilage if yesterday it was part of a cornfield.
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