Are you affected by hose and sprinkler Ban ?

Postby despair » Thu Mar 30, 2006 4:23 pm

What a farce

You can fill a swimming pool , hot tub, fountain, etc but you have to water the garden with watering cans

Totally arse about face the lot of them
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Postby subjecttocontract » Thu Mar 30, 2006 4:37 pm

I agree Despair. Somewhat surprising that you and I see eye to eye on anything but on this I must agree TOTALLY BEYOND BELIEF.

It could only happen in England.......no wonder thousands are leaving these shores every year. Virtually every expat I talk to in my travels never want to return to England again.

Still, its not all bad news......apparantly there are more leaving every year than immigrants ( illegal or otherwise) who are arriving.
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Postby kelmorn » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:17 pm

Was trying to find if I was banned from connecting a hose to my water-butt in London. A google search led to this forum. Thanks :D It appears I am allowed to water my garden using the rain I've collected. But reading this forum and other sources I am now wondering if this "ban" is full of loopholes.

Like most houses I have a cold water tank in the attic. Some info I've found on the net seems to suggest I could use this supply of water if I wanted to. But isnt it still considered water "suplied by my water company"
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Postby Me » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:31 pm

What matters as far as the law is concerned is not whether it is supplied by your water company but whether you are taking water directly from the mains, ie via an outside tap, and delivering it with a hose to your garden.

So you can certainly use a hosepipe to fill a water butt or any other intermediary water storage facility. It would even be legal to exploit the loophole which allows you to walk around the garden with your watering can and a hosepipe pausing occasionally to fill the watering can from the hose.

Connecting to your water storage tank in the loft would, imho, be legal since it is not a direct connection to the mains.
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Postby subjecttocontract » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:59 pm

STOP please, I can't take any more, I haven't laughed so much for ages.

Its got to be a joke, it has to be. You couldn't make such nonsense up.

You can use a pressure washer
You can fill up a swimming pool/hot tub/water butt/ watering can
You can hose down your drive/ flush out your boat engine
You can even leave your inside taps running all day & all night if you want
Garden centres can use a hose all they like
Automatic car washes = business as usual

BUT

You can't water yer tomatoes

Have I been transported to some parallel universe ? No....this is England in all its glory........
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Postby despair » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:19 pm

Yup this is good old England

Wonder how they would have fared in WW2 and Dig for Victory

It truly is totally crazy when swimming pools and pressure washers and car washes have priority over watering the veggies

Must have been something T Blair dreamt up cos he cant understand anyone who is in touch with the land or rural living
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Postby Conveyancer » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:58 pm

Rules that allow orders to be made to prevent wastage of water have been around in one form or another for ages; for example S 74 (1)(c) of the Water Industry Act 1991 provides that the Secretary of State may make orders “preventing the waste, undue consumption and misuse of any water at any time after it has left the pipes of a water undertaker for the purpose of being supplied by that undertaker to any premises”. So I do not think we can blame dear Tony.

The main problem here is lack of rain. No government can make it rain, although I would like to see John Prescott do a rain dance. The previous government saw fit to privatise the water industry; to what extent the shortage of water can be blamed on the failure of a water industry motivated by profit to take appropriate conservation measures I have no idea as I am not an expert on water resources. I suspect that more than anything it is complacency; the belief that there is always going to be enough rain.

When I had a garden I found it took the same amount of time to water it with a watering can as with a hose, a clear indication that hoses waste water. With a hose you always give the plants more water than they need as well as watering the spaces between the plants. I have no way of knowing if the water industry has data, but I suspect that a hosepipe ban does indeed save a lot of water. I doubt many people are filling their swimming pools in early April. All my neighbours had power hoses, but only got them out twice a year. It is disingenuous to say that there is no ban on keeping your bath tap running all day as people do not let their bath taps run all day. I have no idea how much water a carwash uses compared with, say, 20 gardens. So until someone comes up with some statistics I have no idea how effective a hosepipe ban is.

Let’s not blame governments for things that governments cannot control. How differently would matters be dealt with if a different government were in control?
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Postby despair » Mon Apr 03, 2006 9:37 pm

Thames Water have converted 3 reservoirs to housing along with failing to fix lord knows how many leaks so complacency or lack of control who knows

I agree i would like to know the figures for each usage

However the question at issue is

Gardeners are unfairly bearing the brunt of the restrictions because others have either been wasteful of water or the companies have reduced storage areas and failed to fix leaks

Seems to me that all Governments no matter what colour are run by faceless Civil Servants who do not live in the real world

the programme " Yes Prime Minister " ran pretty true to form
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The Ban Begins To Bite

Postby Cytania » Thu Apr 13, 2006 1:40 pm

They cut down all the trees, put 'em in a tree museum and charged all the people just to see 'em
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Postby Me » Thu Apr 13, 2006 2:10 pm

Conveyancer wrote:
---
The main problem here is lack of rain. No government can make it rain
---
I'm not convinced about that. Consider this...

Back in mid-February, soon after the driest January for decades, the water compnaies said that it would take a return to average or better rainfall in the South East to avert hosepipe bans. Now we know, from the Met Office, that February rainfall in South East and South Central England was 107% of the long term average and that March rainfall was 94% of average. Clearly the drought has been averted - especially as the spring is so cold and late that precious little of the rainwater has been lost to condensation or foliating trees.

But no, the water compnaies are pressing on with their bans; indeed three of them are applying for drought orders to empower them to ban many other "non-essential" uses of water. So, perhaps there's another reason for the shortage...

It could be the leaks. The water companies combined managed to lose 793 million gallons every day last year - enough to supply all the needs of one-third of the population (Ofwat - who had the power to fine Thames Water and two others for failing to meet their leakage reduction targets but chose not to do so). But the Environment Agency states categorically that the water shortage isn't caused by leaks.

So could it be the South East's intensive house building programme which adds some 150,000 new homes to the region every year and will continue to so so for another 10 years? Apparently not. The Environment Agency says that all these new water users aren't contributing to the shortage.

So, it must be the lack of rain after all. Indeed, the law says that no water compnay can apply for a drought order unless it can be proven that the cause of the threatened drought is low rainfall and no other reason. So that explains why the Environment Agency and the water companies are at such pains to educate us about the low rainfall.

It also explains why the Environment Agency, in its 24 February press statement urging the water companies in the South East to impose hosepipe bans (funny that - why not just send them a memo?) omitted to mention the weather news published on its own website the day before, informing those who could find it that February's rainfall in the South East had already exceeded the long term average for the month.

Big Brother is pulling a fast one here.
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Postby despair » Thu Apr 13, 2006 4:48 pm

Big Brother has been pulling a fast one for last 7 years or is it 9

He and his missus have misued the Queens flght too
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Postby Conveyancer » Thu Apr 13, 2006 9:30 pm

I am puzzled. Why should a water company want to impose a ban if there is no need for one? Apart from anything else they lose income from metered customers with hosepipes.

Why would any government want to anatagonise people unnecessarily? Doesn't win votes.
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Postby despair » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:03 pm

Oh come on ............this lot dont care who they antagonise
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Postby Me » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:12 pm

There is a need to conserve water -- but HM Govt aren't coming clean about the reasons. They couldn't embarrass Two-Jags by admitting that his crazy escalation of house-building in the south east means that everyone else has to use less water.
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Postby Conveyancer » Thu Apr 13, 2006 11:27 pm

despair wrote:Oh come on ............this lot dont care who they antagonise


Sorry, but you are just not making sense. Why do you think they would want to alienate voters? Not long ago Tony Blair was being accused of trying too hard not to upset anyone. Do you seriously think that the cabinet sits down and tries to think up ways of annoying people. No government does this.
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