Parking Space Problem

Parking Space Problem

Postby sheila3 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:53 pm

I am having some problems with my new neighbours and hope someone on here can give me some advice.
I bought my house in 2006 from a man who had built it using his side garden to form the building plot.
The man has since unfortunately passed away and his nephew who inherited his house sold it last year to a couple who seemed very nice to begin with and I even had them round for tea when they were moving in.
The problem started when they wrote to me saying that the area where I park my car that is between our houses belongs to them and I should stop parking there.
This is not true, when I was negotiating to buy the house we had several discussions about what would happen between the houses and the man I bought it off agreed that I could put paving down and have it as a car parking space.
The space is there because my house faces more south than the original and so there is a wedge shaped piece of land formed by the next door neighbours fence and my wall, I have used this space ever since I bought the house with no problems and the original owner and his nephew both knew it was mine to use and had bought it along with the house so I do not understand why the new owners have any right to claim it as theirs. I have checked my title plans and it is not really clear as the red line sort of goes down the middle of the wedge shape but it is clear that it is a car parking space for my house.
Relationships with next door now are very frosty and I am being advised by friends to get a solicitor to write back to them but I’m afraid this will cost me a lot of money and may even make the situation worse, can anyone suggest an alternative?
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby Collaborate » Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:24 pm

Check your house insurance for legal protection.

The title plan is a rough guide (at times). What's just as important, and mores in the case of ambiguity, are the physical features on the ground. If the builder/vendor/ex-neighbour erected the fence, then that suggests that was where he intended the boundary to be.

If you have to resort to the law then it will cost I'm afraid.

Take as many photos as you can now to show where the boundary is. You don't want them moving the fence when you're away on holiday.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby sheila3 » Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:46 am

Thank you for the reply, unfortunately I do not have legal cover on my insurance so any legal costs I will have to pay. My neighbor came round last night and showed me a copy of their title plan that looks different to mine, on theirs my plot is shaded pink and doesn't include the parking space, the neighbor said that the red line on my plan goes round the outside of my plot so the inside of the line is what I own only, is this right? They say they need the land as they are going to build a side extension on their house but they have said that once the building work is finished they could let me park there again but I'm not happy with this as the man who sold me the house said that the car parking space would belong to me. I have got a free consultation with a solicitor so I will see what comes from that.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby Uriah Heap » Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:39 am

What your neighbour said about the red line going round the outside of your plot sounds plausible sheila.

Beware of solicitors offering free consultations. They do it with a view to getting profitable work from you, and they might not always give you unbiassed advice on whether you have a case, or not. They charge typically £150 to £200 per hour, so even if they just end up writing a couole if letters to your neighbour it could be very expensive.

Can you post the plans on here so we can all see?
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby arborlad » Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:59 am

sheila3 wrote: My neighbor came round last night and showed me a copy of their title plan that looks different to mine, on theirs my plot is shaded pink and doesn't include the parking space,



Assuming both properties are registered you can download plans and deeds for both properties for a small fee, well worth it given the circumstances: https://www.gov.uk/search-property-info ... d-registry




I have got a free consultation with a solicitor so I will see what comes from that.



Not sure when this is but make sure you take with you the plans and deeds in an easy to read format to make the best use of this time.
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smile...it confuses people
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby pilman » Thu Sep 24, 2015 4:41 pm

After the sale of your land was completed you should have received a copy of the land registry documents that included the new register of title for the separated part of the land. This is an A4 typed document and the title plan should have showed how the property was divided from the original title, that is now owned by the new neighbours.

Because there was a division of an existing title, the transfer deed was probably a form TP1, which is the Land Registry form for a Transfer of Part of an existing title.
That transfer should have included a plan that showed the extent of the land that was being transferred together with the newly built house.
The plan used with the TP1 was the one that should have been carefully scrutinised by your solicitor to see that it did include the area you refer to as the parking space.

It may still be possible to obtain a copy of that TP1 form if your solicitor did not provide you with a copy on completion.
Use the Land Registry web-site and download a form OC2, which is the application form for an Official Copy of any documents retained by Land Registry.
Apply for the TP1 transfer deed with its plan, which will need a £7 cheque sent with the form to
Citizen Centre, PO Box 6350, Coventry CV3 9LP. If Land Registry did keep a copy then one will be sent to you by post. If no copy was kept you will need to ask the solicitor who acted for you when buying the property what documents he still has on file. The contract may have used a plan, so that will need to be seen to establish if there were any words used to describe the land or if there was just a plan with the contract.

The current situation is that once the seller had transferred land to you then that land was no longer available to transfer to the person who bought the remainder of the land in the original title.

Your claim to own the parking space needs to be established, so your conveyancing solicitor would be the first person to make enquiries with.
That conveyancer owned you a duty of care to ensure you obtained all the land you contracted to buy, which is why the original contact needs to be looked at.

Whatever was discussed between you and the seller it will all depend on how the contract described the land being sold and then how the transfer deed described the land being sold, because all land transactions have to be in writing.

A verbal agreement cannot count if there is now a dispute about the extent of the land that was sold and the land retained.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby jdfi » Sun Sep 27, 2015 8:44 pm

pilman wrote:
A verbal agreement cannot count if there is now a dispute about the extent of the land that was sold and the land retained.


Do you say this because transfers of land must be by deed, or for some other reason?
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby ukmicky » Tue Sep 29, 2015 2:08 am

jdfi wrote:
pilman wrote:
A verbal agreement cannot count if there is now a dispute about the extent of the land that was sold and the land retained.


Do you say this because transfers of land must be by deed, or for some other reason?


Law of Property (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 1989

Subsection 1 of section 2

A contract for the sale or other disposition of an interest in land can only be made in writing and only by incorporating all the terms which the parties have expressly agreed in one document or, where contracts are exchanged, in each.
Advice given is not legally qualified and you are advised to gain a professional opinion
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby Collaborate » Tue Sep 29, 2015 10:33 am

Don't wish to contradict Pilman (who will doubtless prove me wrong in a jiffy!) but isn't there a difference between that rule, that relates to the enforceability of a contract, and the interpretation of a transfer deed? A mistake can be rectified of course.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby sheila3 » Tue Sep 29, 2015 11:02 am

Thank you all for your comments. I met with the solicitor today and he was very helpful, I managed to get (with the help of a friend!) copies of the title deeds and plans for both properties and also the transfer TP1 documents. It would appear that if you look at all the documentation the parking space was not transferred to my title as the plans and description only show the rectangle of my plot and not the wedge shaped space. However I received an email from the original owners nephew that stated that he understood that his Uncle had given me the parking space and that was why the fence had been put up in the position it had been and that when he (the nephew) sold the original house to my new neighbours they were aware that the space was not theirs. The solicitor has told me that I have a good case for a ‘rectification of titles’ and he has suggested that he could do this through a court process that wouldn’t cost too much money although he couldn’t give me an accurate quote. Has anyone on here any experience of this process and can give me any guidance I would be most grateful if so.
Thank You
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby pilman » Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:21 am

This is not necessarily a court process, although a claim can be made for a judge to rule on the matter.
If there was an initial claim made to a court to decide the matter then legal costs will immediately be incurred.

More often an application is made to Land Registry using a statement of truth signed by the person who sold the original property and by yourself and any other people who can confirm that the wedge of land was in your possession immediately the plot was subdivided. The application can be made by the applicant, as long as a number of forms can be completed when downloaded from the Land Registry web-site. The fee for such an application is £40.

The application will be to amend the title plans for both properties to show more accurately the extent of the land in each title.

On receipt of such an application Land Registry will issue a notice to the other house owner and provide the evidence submitted with the application to show why that application had been made.

It is possible that the neighbour will object to such an application, which will mean that Land Registry will ask both parties if they want to negotiate to decide if the application can proceed with the objector withdrawing their objection.

If the objector insists on continuing their objection then the matter is referred to the Upper Chamber Land Division, which is a tribunal set up to deal with all such disputed applications made to Land Registry.

That is a formal procedure rather like a court proceeding where the winning party will receive an award of costs.
That is why many objectors will withdraw their objection if there is solid evidence provided by the applicant to support their application to have the title plans changed. The thought of incurring legal costs will arise at that stage of the proceedings, which is why conclusive evince in written form is so important.

Starting immediate court proceedings seeking a ruling from a judge that the Land Registry should be instructed to amend the title plans will cause the claimant to become the plaintiff and the other house owner the defendant, so that legal costs start accruing for both parties once the claim is made.

Making an application to Land Registry may allow the application to proceed more speedily as long as the neighbour is shown all the evidence that will be provided to support the change of title plans, because the Seller now confirms in writing that an error was made when the wedge of land was incorrectly included in the second sale when it had already been intended to have it included in the first sale.

A solicitor recommending court action may just be interested in maximising his fees, but it just might be me being cynical to think that.
Spending £40 on a self-help process would always be my way forward, especially if the seller of the neighbour's property is prepared to set out in writing what you have just posted about. Instructing a solicitor whose hourly rate is probably well in excess of £200 per hour +VAT is the alternative way of moving matters forward.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby Roblewis » Wed Sep 30, 2015 7:03 pm

You do not say what the new owners title plan shows. Is the wedge area included? - if so the nephew is not being straight with you in his email.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby MacadamB53 » Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:16 pm

Roblewis wrote:You do not say what the new owners title plan shows. Is the wedge area included? - if so the nephew is not being straight with you in his email.
+1
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby mr sheen » Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:43 pm

I think this is going to be an uphill struggle if the piece of land in question is on the neighbours deeds.
The plans suggest next door owns the piece of land in question and until proven otherwise the registered titles will be considered accurate.
Then...one of the parties in the actual transaction has passed away so the 'understanding' that the nephew has is pretty weak without additional evidence since he was not party to the transaction nor to any negotiations. It is also odd that he has referred to it as an understanding as oppose to recounting exactly what evidence he has of his uncle's intentions to 'give away' a piece of land.....most unusual and quite rightly pretty unacceptable otherwise we could all claim that people who have passed away really wanted to give us some of their land....
the neighbours will want some evidence of this 'understanding' and a reasonable explanation of why the transfer of land didn't include it for the OP but did for the neighbours.
The onus of proof is on OP to prove that the registered titles are incorrect as the result of a mistake...that cannot be corroborated by the transferor since he has passed away.
It would be a rare case where the neighbours will just sit back and allow land on their title to be taken over by a neighbour....and they have already earmarked the land for an extension..so most unlikely that they will not fiercely contest this claim.
The nephew was party to the sale to the neighbour and he transferred what was in the title to them...and if he now gives a statement that the transfer was incorrect and that the total land being transferred to them is less than on the title, they will probably sue him for the loss of the land. So don't be surprised if the nephew becomes unhelpful and uncooperative.
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Re: Parking Space Problem

Postby sheila3 » Fri Oct 02, 2015 2:20 pm

Thank you all again, I think Mr Sheen is right and this is going to be a struggle! The nephew has been very helpful up till now, he has brought me copies of emails between himself and his uncle that talk about the building plot and the fences that were erected and you can see from these that his uncle meant for the parking space to be part of my package, unfortunately it is quite clear on the land registry plans that the wedge did not get transferred as should have happened. The neighbors have admitted (although not in writing) that when they viewed the house the estate agent told them that the fence formed the boundary and the parking space belonged to me and it was only after they bought the house they realized the plans showed different.
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