Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Tue Oct 20, 2015 8:58 pm

My Parents bought their house newly built 45 years ago, and the deeds were retained at that time by the mortgage provider. At this time, there was no requirement to register with Land Registry. They recived the deeds a few years back, but never thought to look through them in detail after living there so long. They recently put the house up for sale, found a good buyer, everything was going smoothly. They were due to move out on Saturday, but yesterday the buyers solicitor flagged that the boundary was in a significantly different place on the plans in the deeds, and the mortgage provider has refused to lend the money, leaving everyone in a very difficult situation, since the buyer has terminated rented accomodation, and my parents have comitted to new rented acomodation, and moved most things out already.

On closer inspection, it seems that the plan on the deeds shows building outline correctly, but shows the surroundings as they were before the house was built. The site was not level, and had a steep bank at the back of the house, shown on the deeds as the boundary line. The builders levelled off this bank, moved it back from the house, then built the back garden fence along the top of it, my parents bought the house like this, and as far as they knew that was the boundary.

Now it seems that my parents have been unlucky here, since the neighbouring properties are both in a similar situation (the bank continues along the back of those houses as well), but the issue was never raised when they were sold on from the original owners some years ago. What seems to have happened there is that the sale has gone through normally, and the buyers solicitors have registered the plots with land registry according to as built boundaries, without the deed plan issue being raised.

Right now I'm trying to establish the best course of action to get the house sold as quickly as possible, and what can my parents do about the wasted expense with solicitors/surveyors etc. considering that they bought the house and land in its current state, and are vitims of someone elses mistake?

The solicitor for my parents seems very vague about the best course of action, and the timescale/cost, which concerns me. As I understand it, they will need to apply for a statutory declaration that the boundary as existing is correct. Does anyone have experience with this sort of thing? Any info on the process, and likely cost/time? Appreciate any feedback.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby arborlad » Tue Oct 20, 2015 9:47 pm

smithydesign wrote: The site was not level, and had a steep bank at the back of the house, shown on the deeds as the boundary line. The builders levelled off this bank, moved it back from the house, then built the back garden fence along the top of it, my parents bought the house like this, and as far as they knew that was the boundary..



Who owns the land on the other side of that fence, have they raised any issues?

If registered, you can obtain the neighbours title plan from Land Registry: https://www.gov.uk/search-property-info ... d-registry
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby ukmicky » Tue Oct 20, 2015 11:47 pm

Hs the land now been registered at the land registry or is it still unregistered.
Advice given is not legally qualified and you are advised to gain a professional opinion
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:05 am

Who owns the land on the other side of that fence, have they raised any issues?


I obtained the registered plans for the surrounding properties, and they suggest that the as built existing boundary is correct. However, there are also patches of land along the back of these houses, inbetween them and the new build houses behind, that don't seem to belong to anyone.I our case though, on Land Registry, the neighbours boundaries go right up to our boundary as built. No issues have evr been raised.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:10 am

ukmicky wrote:Hs the land now been registered at the land registry or is it still unregistered.


Ironically, it seems that if they had voluntarily registered the land before the sale process started, and 'misplaced' the deeds, then this issue would never have been raised. They have the situation now where the buyer still wants the house, and they still want to sell to him, so they will have to resolve this issue. The land is not registered yet. Looks like they will need to register for Absolute Title over the plot, and additionally will need Possessory Title over the land in question, supplying photo evidence and statements of truth. This could take anything from 8 weeks to 6 months. Am hoping for the 8 weeks end of that.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby Collaborate » Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:35 am

smithydesign wrote:Ironically, it seems that if they had voluntarily registered the land before the sale process started, and 'misplaced' the deeds, then this issue would never have been raised. They have the situation now where the buyer still wants the house, and they still want to sell to him, so they will have to resolve this issue. The land is not registered yet. Looks like they will need to register for Absolute Title over the plot, and additionally will need Possessory Title over the land in question, supplying photo evidence and statements of truth. This could take anything from 8 weeks to 6 months. Am hoping for the 8 weeks end of that.


Haven't you answered your original question, save for the likely cost, which the solicitor will tell your parents about?
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby arborlad » Wed Oct 21, 2015 8:49 am

smithydesign wrote:
Who owns the land on the other side of that fence, have they raised any issues?



I our case though, on Land Registry, the neighbours boundaries go right up to our boundary as built. No issues have evr been raised.



So more than one neighbour that you will haver to get evidence from.




However, there are also patches of land along the back of these houses, inbetween them and the new build houses behind, that don't seem to belong to anyone



Before the development, was the bank tree covered or some other obstruction?
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:22 am

Haven't you answered your original question, save for the likely cost, which the solicitor will tell your parents about?


Only found this out last night, after original post, so yes this is the answer. Problem over the last few days is that the solicitor was quite vague - 'this could take months, could cost thousands' just wondered if anyone had experience with similar
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:31 am

Before the development, was the bank tree covered or some other obstruction?


As I understand it, before development the site was sloping along the bank, with no obstruction. The builders levelled the slope, but had to move the bank away from the house. I am guessing there was a reason for this, maybe it was too close to the foundations? I did some further reading on deeds plans based on proposed rather than 'as built' drawings, and it seems that if 'as built' doesn't match, the design intention of the proposed plans will be taken into account when trying to register the correct boundary, so hopefully the fact that the deeds plans show the boundary at the top edge of the bank will help, that is indeed where the boundary is, even though the bank was moved when built.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby Collaborate » Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:46 am

smithydesign wrote:
Haven't you answered your original question, save for the likely cost, which the solicitor will tell your parents about?


Only found this out last night, after original post, so yes this is the answer. Problem over the last few days is that the solicitor was quite vague - 'this could take months, could cost thousands' just wondered if anyone had experience with similar


Your solicitor will have been vague because cost and time depends on many variables, most of which won't be known until later (e.g. how much the other side fights it, how efficient they are in providing disclosure, how many documents are involved). The experiences of others won't tell you what your case will be like.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby arborlad » Wed Oct 21, 2015 5:30 pm

smithydesign wrote:
Who owns the land on the other side of that fence, have they raised any issues?


In our case though, on Land Registry, the neighbours boundaries go right up to our boundary as built. No issues have evr been raised.



So there is no contention and no boundary dispute. A suitably qualified surveyor could carry out the survey tomorrow (with appropriate access) and have signed certified copies for the relevant parties by Friday, some legwork by yourselves might be required.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby Roblewis » Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:36 pm

arborlad wrote:
smithydesign wrote:
Who owns the land on the other side of that fence, have they raised any issues?


In our case though, on Land Registry, the neighbours boundaries go right up to our boundary as built. No issues have evr been raised.



So there is no contention and no boundary dispute. A suitably qualified surveyor could carry out the survey tomorrow (with appropriate access) and have signed certified copies for the relevant parties by Friday, some legwork by yourselves might be required.



Just to add to arborlad that if ALL affected parties agree the boundary in writing there are few costs to register an agreed boundary with the LR
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby smithydesign » Thu Oct 22, 2015 8:23 am

So there is no contention and no boundary dispute. A suitably qualified surveyor could carry out the survey tomorrow (with appropriate access) and have signed certified copies for the relevant parties by Friday, some legwork by yourselves might be required.

Unfortunately not quite that simple . Update from solicitor - Yes they will still need statements from all neighbours, plus the freeholder, plus a survey, but will most likely require a visit from Land Registry, and the land that they consider theirs that isn't shown on the deeds will require an application for title by adverse possession over a period of time. The Land Registry part of the process will take a minimum of 8 weeks, could be as much a 3-4 months, since the land was previously unregistered. LR have said that letting them know a sale is pending can bump them up thh queue, but it depends on the info they receive. They will also need to register the undisputed land with absolute title. There is a slim possibility that LR would give absolute title over the whole plot after considering the info, but they can't really run the risk of further delays should that kind of application be rejected. Thanks or all comments, has helped greatly to understand the situation quickly, will keep posted with updates.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby Collaborate » Thu Oct 22, 2015 9:10 am

will keep posted with updates


Please do. We're a nosy lot here. Also it will help those with similar problems in the future.
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Re: Boundaries incorrect on deeds plan

Postby jonahinoz » Sat Oct 24, 2015 7:18 am

Hi,

Would this be a suitable candidate for INDEMNITY INSURANCE?

John W
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