Offer of some advice please

Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby jonahinoz » Sat Sep 17, 2016 8:28 pm

A 1.8m service strip was shown on the original deeds which was shown routing within garden areas, however when Land Registary reviewed the deeds and developrs plans they moved the inner line of boundary to extend to the roadway. ( For clarification the boundary is now shown on the title plans and extends 1.8m in from the roadway)

Hi Loosey,

What happened when?

Was First Registration of your property in 1985, or earlier?

When did the previous owner move the boundary?

When did your neighbour move into his house?

When was your neighbour's house built, and/or first registered?

Is the previous owner of your house available to give evidence that he moved the boundary, and when?

You say the LR reviewed the "deeds and developers plans". Does that mean they had looked at them during first registration, and the looked at them again (RE-viewed) at a later date?

John W
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Loosey » Sat Sep 17, 2016 9:13 pm

MacadamB53 wrote:
Loosey wrote:We have a boundary shown as a concrete separating our house from my neighbour as defined on the Land Registary Title Plans for both of our properties.

My neighbour decided to moved the boundary between our houses in accordance with the deed plans which has resulted in me loosing a proportiion of our land to him.

Obviously we want our rightful land back

My questions to the board are :

a) Do the Title Plans hold title over Deed plans which are indicated as for information only
b) My neighbour would have recieved a copy of the deed plans at his practical completion, but would he have also recieved a copy of his Title plans at the same time showing the amended
position of the boundary.

No applicaton has been made for adverse possession.

Thanks in advance for any help or advice
you will need to make a successful AP claim before you can make such an assertion - he's down nowt unlawful.

Kind regards, Mac


Dont think i would have to make a claim for AP as the land is already mine as per my Land title, sorry i dont understand the last bit of your reply
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Collaborate » Sat Sep 17, 2016 10:21 pm

Your post is confusing. You appear to say that your neighbour has moved the position of the boundary marker so as to align it with the boundary shown in the deeds.

The confusing thing is you talk about title plans and deed plans. They are one and the same. In the transfer deed in to your name there may be a plan. The land registry have their plan. Is that what you mean? If the LR title plan does not accord with the plan in the transfer deed you can ask them to rectify it. Look at the umpteen threads on this site about how LR plans aren't exact.
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Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby mr sheen » Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:03 am

Are you saying that there was a dispute before you bought the property and during that the boundary was moved to its current position and you bought it in its current position but now want it moved...cos if so you have no chance.

The dispute would have been resolved by the previous owner and neighbour...ie the boundary position was agreed.
The boundary on the ground was clear to you when you bought it and if you weren't happy with the boundaries, you should not have proceeded with the purchase.
Having proceeded with the purchase without any dispute of the boundaries, you accepted them as they were on the ground and you bought what you saw. If you didn't agree with the boundaries you should have raised it with your solicitor during the process of purchase.

The LR know it was transferred just a year ago and no challenges to the LR details were brought during he transferr and that the plans show general boundaries only and this is a piece of land of less than 2m....so are unlikely to get involved.

You would have to get solicitors involved and be willing to pursue the matter to court. Sending a solicitors letter will result in nothing other than him replying and it costing you money.

It seems that the change was agreed between the neighbours as part of the resolution of a dispute, so you will not get the land back.
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby arborlad » Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:11 am

arborlad

smile...it confuses people
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Loosey » Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:41 am

arborlad wrote:http://www.gardenlaw.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=20465


Sorry if you found my origional post confusing

There is a discrepancy in the location boundary seperating my property and my neighbours property,

The boudary on both of our deed plans is in the same position, my understanding is that boundarys shown on deed plans are for information only, not drawn to scale,
are not legal and are retained for historical information only.

Land Registary moved the boundary which is now in the same position on both our Title plans by 1.8m in my favor

It meant that my neighbour lost 1.8m and i gained 1.8m ( the width of a service strip)
Land Registary aligned all site boundarys to end at the road and not 1.8m inward of the road edge.

I obviously hold title to to the Land as shown on my land Registary Title Plan and he does not

All i wanted to know what is the legal position as my neighbour is unwilling to give up this bit of land untill the legal position has been clarified.
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Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby arborlad » Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:59 am

Loosey wrote:A 1.8m service strip was shown on the origional deeds which was shown routing within garden areas, however when Land Registary reviewed the deeds and developrs plans they moved the inner line of boundary to extend to the roadway.

Sometime before we move in my neighbour had a dispute with the previous owner of the property over overhanging plantings, my neighbour decided to move the boundary from the position as shown on their Title Plans into the old position shown on their title deeds.



It's almost as if two different areas of land are being discussed - is that the case?

To prevent any further confusion, I shall be requesting that your two threads be merged..........until that happens it really would be in everyones best interests if this is the only thread contributed to.
arborlad

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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Collaborate » Sun Sep 18, 2016 3:41 pm

Have you studied the numerous threads in which LR plans are said to be a general guide only, and not precise?

As Mac says, if the fence was built in the wrong place initially you may have a point - it will depend on how long it's been there, and whether you can make a claim for AP. Your neighbour could apply for rectification of the LR plan if an error has been made.
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Loosey » Sun Sep 18, 2016 4:31 pm

Collaborate wrote:Have you studied the numerous threads in which LR plans are said to be a general guide only, and not precise?

As Mac says, if the fence was built in the wrong place initially you may have a point - it will depend on how long it's been there, and whether you can make a claim for AP. Your neighbour could apply for rectification of the LR plan if an error has been made.


Hi thanks for the reply

There was no fence built it was was all open plan untill my neighbour decided to take my land. surely i dont have to make a claim for AP as i have registered title to it.
A clear boundary is shown on my Title plan which matches up with the boundary on my neighbours Title plan. As i understand it no error was made LR moved the boundary before i bought the property

Cheers
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby despair » Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:16 pm

if your neighbour since you bought and moved in has placed a fence on the wrong line and both your title deeds and his agree that the line he has used are



is incorrect theres no argument

he is the one who is wrong so move the fence to the correct line and tell him to go fly ackite
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Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby MacadamB53 » Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:44 pm

Hi Loosey,

from your other thread:
Loosey wrote:
arborlad wrote:http://www.gardenlaw.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=20465


Sorry if you found my origional post confusing

There is a discrepancy in the location boundary seperating my property and my neighbours property,

The boudary on both of our deed plans is in the same position, my understanding is that boundarys shown on deed plans are for information only, not drawn to scale,
are not legal and are retained for historical information only.

Land Registary moved the boundary which is now in the same position on both our Title plans by 1.8m in my favor

It meant that my neighbour lost 1.8m and i gained 1.8m ( the width of a service strip)
Land Registary aligned all site boundarys to end at the road and not 1.8m inward of the road edge.

I obviously hold title to to the Land as shown on my land Registary Title Plan and he does not

All i wanted to know what is the legal position as my neighbour is unwilling to give up this bit of land untill the legal position has been clarified.
I will repeat, the title plan does not define what you own - it is a reference doc so that upon reading the register one has an idea as to whereabouts in the world the land being described can be found.

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby Loosey » Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:05 pm

despair wrote:if your neighbour since you bought and moved in has placed a fence on the wrong line and both your title deeds and his agree that the line he has used are
is incorrect theres no argument

he is the one who is wrong so move the fence to the correct line and tell him to go fly ackite


Hi thanks for the reply
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Re: Re Land Registry Title Plans

Postby MacadamB53 » Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:40 pm

despair wrote:if your neighbour since you bought and moved in has placed a fence on the wrong line and both your title deeds and his agree that the line he has used are



is incorrect theres no argument

he is the one who is wrong so move the fence to the correct line and tell him to go fly ackite
that's not right, and isn't helpful to the OP.

Loosey, the title plan does not show boundaries - only their general whereabouts.

please understand we are all trying to help - not just those who agree with you...

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby Eliza » Mon Sep 19, 2016 8:39 am

That last post on this thread has got me confused.

From looking at it - it looks like your property lost 1.8 metres in one direction but gained 1.8 metres in another direction?? Well - if that's the case then it looks as if your garden still has the same amount of square feet of land as it had originally and no land has been lost by your house at all. Instead the distribution of land was just re-arranged rather.

Is that the case? If so - it does seem pretty logical - as there would appear to be no loss of growing space.
Apologies for not giving exact personal details in my posts - you never know who is reading....
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Re: Offer of some advice please

Postby COGGY » Mon Sep 19, 2016 9:50 am

Hi Loosey

I don't read it as though you are discussing two pieces of land. It is however very confusing. Is it possible for you to put a plan or sketch to help clarify the problem? Regards Coggy
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