Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Fri Oct 14, 2016 8:59 am

Hi, I hope someone knowledgeable can help...
The external wall of our house is the land boundary and we currently have a soil pipe running down the side of the house, across the bottom (slightly below our ground level, but above the neighbours) then back into our garden going into a septic tank in our garden.
(see attached image)

The land next door used to be a church which has recently been knocked down with the developers putting some houses up - now very close to our house. The pipe is understandably unsightly from their point of view and want me to move it... but even if I wanted to move it, I have nowhere for it go. The pipe was there before we bought the house from an extension put in 20+ years ago.

The new building is approx 1m from my wall and they'll put a path up the side, next to the pipe.

What is the legal/regulation view on this? Have they got a case for forcing me to move it?
Attachments
pipe small.png
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby MacadamB53 » Fri Oct 14, 2016 9:30 am

Hi CrazyHorseB,

Have they got a case for forcing me to move it?

no they haven't.

because the pipe has been there for +20 years it has acquired the right to be there.

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:21 am

Thanks Mac - Is that like a "squatters rights" thing?! How many years does something have to be there to gain a right to stay?
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby MacadamB53 » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:27 am

Hi,

the right to use another's land (e.g. as a right of way) is called an easement.

these can be granted by deed or, as in your case, acquired through long user (+20 years).

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Fri Oct 14, 2016 10:59 am

Thanks again... the 20+ years I said was a number I plucked out of the air because I know its a long time. I'll have to check if it is over 20 years. If it ends up being 19 years, would that change things?
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby MacadamB53 » Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:23 am

CrazyHorseB wrote:Thanks again... the 20+ years I said was a number I plucked out of the air because I know its a long time. I'll have to check if it is over 20 years. If it ends up being 19 years, would that change things?
20 is the magic number
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Fri Oct 14, 2016 12:00 pm

I've looked through the old plans and it's unclear when the pipe will have been put in. The house has had 2 extensions on that side - one in 1972 and one in 1999.
If it's proved that the pipe was installed in 1999 then what options do I have - can they force me to move it or is there another route to gaining the deed of easement? (getting it through agreement with the developers is obviously unlikely!)
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby mr sheen » Fri Oct 14, 2016 1:52 pm

Money talks!
Agreement or payment are Probably your only options if not 20+ years.
Yes they can force its removal off their land.
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:41 pm

I'm pretty sure the pipe was part of the original extension (1972) so it shouldn't be a problem, I'm not sure where the emphasis on proving it will be though.
If it turns out to be less than 20 years then money wont be the problem - they're putting the houses so close to ours, they think access will be a problem and want the pipe moved to use the complete width of the path.

Perhaps not putting the new house so close to ours might have been a better idea... they had about 50m width to play with!
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby mr sheen » Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:12 pm

You will have to prove when the pipe was put in place so being 'pretty sure' won't cut it.
They are entitled to the full width of all their land and any encroaching items can be removed from their land. The pipe may well impede their access but they will get it moved unless you can prove you have gained a prescriptive easement to have it there.

If you can't prove a prescriptive easement then you will have to buy an easement but from what you say about it impeding access and the plans for the houses being close it is unlikely a hefty wad load will buy it.
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby despair » Fri Oct 14, 2016 7:11 pm

The only pipe i can see is a guttering downpipe which should not be discharging into a septic tank
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby Collaborate » Fri Oct 14, 2016 11:13 pm

mr sheen wrote:You will have to prove when the pipe was put in place so being 'pretty sure' won't cut it.
They are entitled to the full width of all their land and any encroaching items can be removed from their land. The pipe may well impede their access but they will get it moved unless you can prove you have gained a prescriptive easement to have it there.

If you can't prove a prescriptive easement then you will have to buy an easement but from what you say about it impeding access and the plans for the houses being close it is unlikely a hefty wad load will buy it.


In civil cases the burden of proof is the balance of probabilities. Therefore you merely have to prove that it's more likely than not.
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby CrazyHorseB » Mon Oct 17, 2016 11:24 am

despair wrote:The only pipe i can see is a guttering downpipe which should not be discharging into a septic tank


You can't see it on the photo - it's a waste pipe which runs behind the bushes (marked in red).
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Re: Waste pipe over neighbouring land

Postby Collaborate » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:37 pm

nothingtodowithme wrote:

whilst it is true in civil cases the burden of proof is the balance of probabilities;it is indeed for the judge to decide what is more likely than not. :wink:


Well, I wasn't suggesting that was the function of the usher.
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