Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby upset! » Fri Dec 10, 2010 11:29 pm

My new neighbours have just got planning to put a very large dormer (permitted development)on the rear of their bungalow overlooking my bungalows lounge and bedroom. My property is set back from the road so the back of their house backs onto the front of mine. I never used to be able to see their bungalow as there were so many trees which I liked but the previous owners cleared the garden and strimmed our boundary hedge within an inch of its life before selling it. We can now see their bungalow roof and they will be able to see into our bungalow, front and side garden. I want to know what I can do/plant to stop them looking into my bungalow. We will loose all our privacy and I'm really upset about. I've heard their are rules against growing anything too high, I was hoping to plant a few leylandii!!
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby w3526602 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 8:07 am

Hi,

Your neighbour has side stepped the Planning hurdle. Now he has building regs to get over.

My council (Neath Port Talbot) in South Wales have produced a booklet about what is/isn't allowed regarding windows. We are not allowed to have windows in habitable rooms facing other windows in habitable rooms, if they are less tham 20 metres apart.

Buy a caravan (£50 on Ebay) park it in your garden while your Leylandi are maturing. I am joking ..... but keep it in mind.

602
602 (That was my "last three")
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby TO » Sat Dec 11, 2010 2:54 pm

Hi

I'm surprised a very large dorma doesn't require planning permission as it is adding volume, something that does require planning permission.

Upset, you say
My new neighbours have just got planning to put a very large dormer (permitted development)
, and w3526602 says
Your neighbour has side stepped the Planning hurdle
. The neighbours have neither side stepped planning or got planning. They are exercising their rights. Rights that you too very likely have, but just choose not to exercise. Just because you choose not to exercise your right doesn't mean your neighbour shouldn't exercise theirs.

w3526602 says
Now he has building regs to get over
Building Regs are not so much a hurdle to get over as a check that ensures the job is done right, you won't be consulted or be able to object and prevent them putting the window in.

Upset you say
there were so many trees which I liked but the previous owners cleared the garden and strimmed our boundary hedge within an inch of its life
. If you like trees in the garden then you will have to plant your own. You can't rely on your neighbour planting up their garden to your liking, and whilst you don't like what happened, it was their garden to do with as they liked.

There are no hard and fast rules about the heights that plants, and specifically evergreen trees and shrubs can be grown. Whilst the Anti-social behaviour Act 2003 gives Local Authorities powers to act in high hedge disputes each case is looked at on its individual merits.

I would agree Leylandi are an ideal fast growing screen but keep them apart so they are individual trees, or allow them to coalesce below 2m, or plant other deciduous trees and shrubs between them, Beech or Hornbeam make good hedging and retain their leaves and therefore screening, but don't fall within the scope of the Act.

w3526602 says
My council (Neath Port Talbot) in South Wales have produced a booklet about what is/isn't allowed regarding windows. We are not allowed to have windows in habitable rooms facing other windows in habitable rooms, if they are less tham 20 metres apart.
. Most Planning Authorities have similar rules, but only in relation to new development.

w3526602 says
Buy a caravan (£50 on Ebay) park it in your garden while your Leylandi are maturing.
Interesting idea. I read somewhere once that following a spell of residents felling protected trees to improve their sea views the Local Authority, (Australian), stacked a number of sea containers on the land, which was theirs, to replace the trees.

TO
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby despair » Sat Dec 11, 2010 3:25 pm

Grow a mix of deciduous and evergreen shrubs preferably not Leylandi as they are high maintanance

Think of Clump forming Bamboos
Photinia
Euyonymous
Japonicas

Temporarily or even permanatly you could install tall bamboo or metal poles just back from the boundary with wires srung between and plant a selection of evergreen and non evergren climbers like

Clematis Montana
Clmatis Armandii
Honeysuckles
Hybrid Clematis especially Viticella varieties
Summer Jasmine
Nasturtians
Sweet peas

Wisteria

and just let them all romp away with lots of good compost when planting and kept well watered they will soon screen off the neighbours
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby ferdinand2000 » Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:00 am

upset! wrote:My new neighbours have just got planning to put a very large dormer (permitted development)


Could you clarify?

If it's permitted development they don't need planning permission. Which is it?

Rgds

F
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby w3526602 » Mon Mar 14, 2011 5:45 pm

. Most Planning Authorities have similar rules, but only in relation to new development.

Hi TO,

Are you saying that Permitted Development is not new development?

I know that some (all?) councils are granting PP, but with the restriction that only those windows in the current plans may be installed. If, in future, you want extra windows, you have to submit a new PP application .... in effect, they are removing your permitted development rights.

Is the 20 metre rule contained in Planning, Building Regs, or local By-laws?

602
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby TO » Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:12 pm

Hi

Permitted development maybe new development but you don't need planning permission, it's permitted development without the need for planning permission, therefore the standards cannot apply.

All development that requires consent must be completed in accordance with the approved plans, including numbers and locations of windows. Any material amendment during the build, such as larger/more windows will require a further application the impact of which will be given due consideration.

It's not unusual for planning consents for new dwellings to include a condition that removes the permitted development rights, or any other conditions considered appropriate. If such a condition applies you would have to apply for planning permission for anything that would otherwise be permitted but isn't because of the condition, and the impact of the proposal will be considered.

Distances between windows are something that could differ from Authority to Authority as they are the Authorities own take on the national guidance. You will find them in the Supplementary Planning Guidance or Local Development Plan Documents. They are not hard or fast rules either, but can be ignored depending on local circumstances, e.g. if the existing dwellings in the neighbourhood have windows closer than the guidance stipulates, and the new build seeks to reflect the local vernacular.

TO
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby w3526602 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:00 am

Hi TO,

Thanks for that.

So the council can move the goal posts at their own discretion.

If you opt for Permitted Development, can you just get stuck in, or do you have to advise the Planners of your intentions, so that they can decide if its Permitted or not?

I hope this isn't going OT .... I think its still relevent to the priginal question.

602
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby TO » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:13 am

Hi

The Council aren't moving the goalposts. They withdraw permitted development rights when they consider it appropriate, for whatever reason, and that should be set out in the decision notice. Usually it will be for something along the lines of ensuring the neighbours amenity/living conditions aren't compromised, or to maintain the character of the area.

If you have permitted development rights and you know what you can do and stick to it you can just get stuck in. However, it would be worth discussing with the Planning Authority to check exactly what you can do, especially if you are not sure, and forewarn them so that when the neighbours kick off you find you haven't scored an own goal.

Permitted development rights are once only, so once used up can't be used again. Your house may have planning history, for say an extension that used up the rights before you bought it. You don't then have permitted rights to extend further and will require permission, and this will be made clear if you speak to a Planning Officer.

Of course other restrictions can apply Article 4 directions for example, and your friendly Planning Officer would also point this out.

Getting advice and guidance first is always a good idea. The trouble is too many people think they are being clever by avoiding advice and end up a lot worse off, the Local Authority is of course always the one at fault.

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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby w3526602 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 4:35 pm

the Local Authority is of course always the one at fault.

Hi TO,

And I thought it was always the fault of the Prime Minister (any Prime Minister)

My apologies for going OT .......

Do a Google for WELSH WATERWAYS FESTIVAL. Look at the picture of the new slipway into the canal.
The problem is ..... the car park is the same level as the highway. The Planners didn't notice that the surface of the canal is a few inches above the level of the road. It became somewhat noticable when they re-filled that stretch of the canal. :shock: :oops:
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby pilman » Sat Mar 26, 2011 1:44 am

Permitted development rights are once only, so once used up can't be used again. Your house may have planning history, for say an extension that used up the rights before you bought it. You don't then have permitted rights to extend further and will require permission


Far too generalised a statement.
There are many permitted development rights that can be exercised after one has already been completed.
Extend to the rear.
Extend to the side.
Erect a porch
Convert the loft.
Erect buildings all over the garden.
Lots of things can be done since 2008 amendment changed the PD rules.


The 20 metres rule also went out years ago, so 602 is well out of date with his info, and his understanding of the fact that permitted development is planning permission granted by the Government.
It has nothing to do with the Local Planning Authority.
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby w3526602 » Sun Mar 27, 2011 8:06 am

The 20 metres rule also went out years ago, so 602 is well out of date with his info,

Hi Pilman,

Thanks for that bit of info. I live and learn.

602
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby TO » Sun Mar 27, 2011 9:42 am

Hi
TO wrote:Permitted development rights are once only, so once used up can't be used again. Your house may have planning history, for say an extension that used up the rights before you bought it. You don't then have permitted rights to extend further and will require permission.


pilman wrote:Far too generalised a statement.
There are many permitted development rights that can be exercised after one has already been completed.
Extend to the rear.
Extend to the side.
Erect a porch
Convert the loft.
Erect buildings all over the garden.
Lots of things can be done since 2008 amendment changed the PD rules.

Pilman, you have clearly been looking at the interactive house. I'm sure you will have noticed that nowhere does it say that Permitted Development rights are infinite, they are not. Once you have used them up you can't use them up again, they have been used up, and are once only.

pilman wrote:The 20 metres rule also went out years ago
Separation distances between new dwellings still exist, albeit they are not rules, more guidance, and are quite strictly applied.

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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby pilman » Sun Mar 27, 2011 12:30 pm

As I do not know what the mention of "interactive house" actually refers to, I need to clarify what I look at when deciding what constitutes permitted development within the curtilage of a dwellinghouse.

The details are set out in the Government's Statutory Instrument that goes under the impressive title of
S T A T U T O R Y I N S T R U M E N T S
2008 No. 2362
TOWN AND COUNTRY PLANNING, ENGLAND
The Town and Country Planning (General Permitted
Development) (Amendment) (No. 2) (England) Order 2008

This can be found on the following web-site
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2008 ... 362_en.pdf

It is in everyone's best interest to read all of Part 1 classes A to H so that it becomes clear exactly what is allowed.
I could not see any restrictions, as previously applied, when the volume that could be developed was stated in the original GPDO introduced in 1995.

Since 2008 much has changed, including the right to carry on extending a house and erecting buildings, in the plural, in the garden.
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Re: Large windows overlooking lounge and bedroom

Postby TO » Sun Mar 27, 2011 6:19 pm

Hi

Interactive house
http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/permission/house

Once you have used up your permitted developments you require planning permission. Your permitted rights are not infinite. Where in the legislation does it set out your right to
pilman wrote:carry on extending a house and erecting buildings, in the plural, in the garden.


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