Right of Way and New gate

Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby ukmicky » Fri Nov 11, 2016 3:25 am

In regards to what he wrote he may have a case to argue that his permission was only granted for the current development that the planning permission was granted for and if it times out his permission may time out also.


Under the current permission agreed with the planners ,providing what was provided to the planners holds up as something that provides you with an assurance that you can perform the work ,once you start spending on reliance of his permission he would be prevented under equity from adding extra conditions or preventing you from performing the work due to the doctrine of propriety estoppel.


You may already have the right under the doctrine of propriety estoppel to do it anyway because he was meant to have performed the work himself when he was granted permission to convert your building and by agreeing with the planners to perform the work and not doing it, you and your land is suffering.

For there to be a propriety estoppel there needs to be

1.A representation or assurance; Which was given to the planners
2. An act of detrimental reliance; You buying the property expecting him to perform the work the planners said was necessary for your property to built.
3. An unconscionable denial of the claimant’s right. Him not performing the work or preventing you from doing it.
Advice given is not legally qualified and you are advised to gain a professional opinion
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby marine1983 » Fri Nov 11, 2016 9:22 am

Sorry my neighbor is also a new tenant. He was not liable for the driveway condition. The people that sold the property (split the farm ) were the ones who should of widened the driveway splay prior to living in (our house) it was a condition of entry prior to it being given residential status.

I guess we have gone off track to my original question. It was just interesting to find out peoples opinions on this. We of course will complete the splays within the 6 year period just to cover our arse. Just playing devils advocate and some things he mentioned in the discussion centered around the access at present and when we are looking to complete it.
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby arborlad » Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:03 am

marine1983 wrote: I may add that even though its stipulated in the deeds the council still wanted a signed letter stating that he was happy for us to improve the splays over his land. He signed happily. It leads to a question for me now. We have been given planning and legally entitled to carry out the plan. Does that mean the 6 years is now legally a non entity? Can we carry on say in 20 years time etc? Has he in effect signed his land away?




No, there'll be no change in land ownership, whatever he owns now he will continue to own. What will change is either the surfacing or the addition of kerbs etc., in order to comply with current regulations.

If the track where it meets the highway is similar to the photo, it could be mutually beneficial to improve this.
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smile...it confuses people
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby marine1983 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 8:33 am

Hello me again.

Rather than start a new thread I thought I would update this one.

I just want to get your thoughts on what my neighbour is now doing. We have been approved planning permission to improve the access to the drive. We have contractors on site to start the works approved. I was away on business when our contractor called to say that our neighbour (owns the land but signed the document to allow + plus the planning permission) has stopped him from working.

He has text us last night saying that he wants to speak to our architect and planning before we commence any works (thats already been approved mind you) can proceed. He is concerned there is no drainage on the plans, as far as i understand it we dont actually need it due to being on private land. (We were going to put it in anyway) He has just jumped to a conclusion, its frustrating why he doesnt speak to us!


My question is what is our legal standpoint on this matter?

We have an approved plan from highways

We have a signed document from him we can have access across his land to carry out works.

Its in the deeds that we have 6 years entitlement across his land. (We have a year to go still)

If he wants the architect, then in my opinion he should pay for the site visit.

Can we claim loss, 2 days contractor wastage plus 2 days of my own business expense?

We really dont want this to get messy, but it seems to be creeping down that path. I just want to be armed with a little knowledge as we have a meeting with him today to try and ease his fears..
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby MacadamB53 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 9:23 am

Hi marine1983,

if his signed permission references the approved planning application you only need to tolerate his demands to keep things civil.

if his signed permission does not reference the approved planning application you may need to consider his demands.

what does the signed permission state?

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby marine1983 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 10:29 am

Hi Mac,

Please find the letter attached. It does specifically state the planning application ref number. I have also scanned the deed entitlement for your reading. As I say we are covered by planning approval and the letter plus the deeds. I'm not sure what else we could of done.
Attachments
deed clipping-min.jpg
deed clipping-min.jpg (85 KiB) Viewed 292 times
letter of consentredacted.jpg
letter of consentredacted.jpg (86.32 KiB) Viewed 292 times
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby MacadamB53 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 11:55 am

Hi marine1983,

thanks for the scanned images.

he wants to speak to our architect and planning before we commence any works... ...He is concerned there is no drainage on the plans

those would be the same plans he referenced in the "avoidance of doubt" letter?

what a plonker.

do you suspect he's intentionally trying to frustrate so the six years elapses without progress? or is he not that sort?

what "drainage" was he expecting? if it is an existing feature you need to comply with his demands as the deed stipulates you must ensure the access is not downgraded...

Kind regards, Mac
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby marine1983 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:05 pm

MacadamB53 wrote:Hi marine1983,

thanks for the scanned images.

he wants to speak to our architect and planning before we commence any works... ...He is concerned there is no drainage on the plans

those would be the same plans he referenced in the "avoidance of doubt" letter?

what a plonker.

do you suspect he's intentionally trying to frustrate so the six years elapses without progress? or is he not that sort?

what "drainage" was he expecting? if it is an existing feature you need to comply with his demands as the deed stipulates you must ensure the access is not downgraded...

Kind regards, Mac


I certainly think he is being malicious he knew full well our intentions and has turned our contractor away while my partner is on holiday. I have had to come back from my own work (also a contractor so lost revenue for me also)

There is no drainage on site, the rain runs down the track and through our yard. We are looking into trying to divert the rain somewhere but I dont feel its particularly nesseceary. Our only condition was to not allow rain to fall back onto the carriage way. Which would be impossible.

My question is what can we do about it?

Are we able to let the contractor proceed should he want to be placed in that position?

Is he entitled to have a meeting with highways again?

He has a stock fence, which will need to come down shown in previous pictures on the right. No livestock is in the parcel of land. We of course will replace it, my concern he will try to do us for criminal damage or something for removal of the fence. (He is an ex copper so I think he is trying to play silly buggers)

Can we claim loss of earnings? Loss of 2 days contracting ? etc
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby mr sheen » Wed Aug 02, 2017 12:44 pm

Tit for tat stuff.....didn't you seek ways to make it difficult for him to have a gate?

You make my life difficult....I'll respond in a similar manner

He has a right to ensure that works carried out on his land comply with all statutory requirements and H&S legislation etc etc he can enforce this to the absolute letter, comma, full stop etc or he can be flexible.....if you think back to how flexible you were then you may have an idea which he will favour.
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Re: Right of Way and New gate

Postby marine1983 » Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:18 pm

mr sheen wrote:Tit for tat stuff.....didn't you seek ways to make it difficult for him to have a gate?

You make my life difficult....I'll respond in a similar manner

He has a right to ensure that works carried out on his land comply with all statutory requirements and H&S legislation etc etc he can enforce this to the absolute letter, comma, full stop etc or he can be flexible.....if you think back to how flexible you were then you may have an idea which he will favour.



Hmm completely missed my point. I didn't make life difficult at all, he installed the gate I was only questioning whether he was allowed to or not.

I agree he has every right for me to comply with the letter of the approval. However you didn't answer the question merely slung mud at me accusing me of being awkward, i'm only trying to exercise my right to carry out the approved planning.

My question was does he have grounds to refuse work completely ignoring the fact of the matter of planning consent.

I have had a discussion and we have come to some common ground. He has accepted the works now after some explanation and a few popped blood vessels.
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