Fallen leaves and fruit

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thin and crispy
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Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by thin and crispy » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:59 pm

I think the basics of the law pertaining to this question must already have been covered in the forum but, having a particularly awkward neighbour, I'd appreciate members' thoughts on the circumstances pertaining in this case.

My neighbour has several trees in his garden, including apple and pear trees. Come autumn, a sizeable proportion of the leaves and fallen fruit end up in my garden (in the borders, and on my paths and patio). I usually wait until late November, when the trees are completely bare, before sweeping it all up. I know that might sound a bit slovenly to any garden lovers reading this, but I just don't have the time to sweep my garden from end to end repeatedly throughout the autumn.

My tidying schedule is not good enough for my neighbour though. He insists that I pick up all of his fallen fruit -- most of which is maggot ridden as he's an organic (actually, biodynamic) gardener -- and return it to him within 24 hours of it falling. Likewise with the fallen leaves, which he wishes to compost. His leaves tend to get mixed with the leaves from my trees, but he doesn't want mine because 'they are not biodynamically grown' (yes, he's awkward as well as gullible). If I don't return 'his property' to him in a timely manner, he threatens to trespass into my garden (by removing my fence panels) to collect the windfalls, and presumably sort the leaves, himself.

Frankly, I don't think it's reasonable for him to demand, under threat of repeatedly invading my property, that I undertake regular episodes of gardening-tidying on his behalf, let alone sort his leaves from mine.

The odd thing is, he collects the apples which fall onto his land and lines them up, balanced on the top of my fence until they inevitably fall one way or another. I'm not sure whether that reflects some spiritual/biodynamic practice or whether he just needs medical help.

I don't want to bore you with the history, but members who have read some of my previous posts (both here and on nfh.org.uk) will understand what a difficult and obsessive (I'd say mentally unstable) person he is; and I'm quite sure this is just a continuation of the low-level harassment which he started 20 years ago.

My response to his demands so far has been to politely, yet succinctly, suggest that he 'go forth and multiply'.

Does anyone have any other suggestions please?
Prejudice, not being founded on reason, cannot be removed by argument. Samuel Johnson.

despair
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by despair » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:57 am

Your neighbour is clearly insane

I suggest you ensure all fence panels are screwed to prevent removal and i would have great fun pushing all apples balanced on the top of your fence over to his side with a stick

liveinpeace
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by liveinpeace » Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:00 am

well you have certainly won the bonkers neighbour competition.
I would be tempted to tell him pleasantly but firmly that you will not be returning his fruit of separating his leaves and that you have been using pesticides on aphids in your garden, this should get the desired bonkers monologue that you must have repeatedly heard already. All the while i would be filming this on your phone. i think you are quite right in the fact that he is seriously unhinged and his demands are both bizarre and unacceptable, also with the added threat of trespass, i think you would have a good case to get some kind of injunction against him, to stop him bothering you.
I know people will say the police have better things to do, but i do think the insanity of his demands might give the local police a little light hearted relief. plus it would be reassuring for you to see their reactions to how utterly crazy his demands are.

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thin and crispy
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by thin and crispy » Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:43 am

Hi despair and liveinpeace. Thanks for replying.

The fence panels are already fixed with screws that make a 'friction fit' with the concrete posts. Last year he smashed two panels out of the blue for no apparent reason; I have now upgraded my CCTV to cover the fence (I've had CCTV pointing elsewhere for years because of this moron).

The police have been 'amused' by his antics before, liveinpeace. I've mentioned elsewhere on the forum that we've experienced a long history of bizarre and harassing behaviour. Many years ago, after he tried to break into my house, he told the police I was a nuclear physicist and that he needed to get in so he could stop me doing 'midnight scientific experiments' in my back bedroom. After they finished laughing, they warned him to stop harassing us, but they had insufficient evidence to charge him. That's when I installed the CCTV.

Eventually, when he could see he wasn't getting anywhere with me, he turned his attention to the neighbours on his other side for a couple of years - fixating on their sewers amongst other things. Apparently, he also kept pestering them to send their 4-year old child to the local Steiner-Waldorf school (a chain of schools which, I have read, indoctrinates kids with the same kind of pseudo-spiritual nonsense that rattles around inside his head - e.g. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-28646118). Fortunately for the child, her parents didn't comply with his wishes.

Now, he has been dismissed from his job (unsurprisingly) so is at home all of the time. I guess boredom and frustration has triggered a worsening of his mental problems, and he has started hectoring us again. We usually ignore his demands as far as possible - hence my rather direct two-word reply to him.

I don't think he will actually try to get into my garden, because he now knows what will await him. It's just that he can't help trying to assert some kind of dominance over people; and his latest lunacy over leaves etc. is another vain attempt to do that.

The pesticide idea is a good one, as he hates me using any sprays in my garden. He doesn't use anything in his. He won't even use tap water on his plants because he sees it as unnatural. Instead it has to be rain water. That in itself is reasonable, but he then has to process it in a flow-form (a peculiar type of waterfall used by biodynamic gardeners) before he carefully extracts a few cupfuls to irrigate his plants. He says the flow-form 'polishes' the water! I hope his plants appreciate it.

Any thoughts on the fruit that falls into my garden? I understand that the law says it is his, but surely it doesn't oblige me to go to the trouble of collecting it for him. Is that correct?
Prejudice, not being founded on reason, cannot be removed by argument. Samuel Johnson.

span
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by span » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:06 pm

Why don't you lop off the overhanging branches? Trim them back to the boundary? No more falling fruit, and cuts down on blown leaf litter too.

despair
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by despair » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:55 pm

I would get friends preferably other neighbours round for garden tea parties ...that will bring him out then your friends cam laugh at is antics

These kind of idiots cant bear to be talked about in the neighbourhood

liveinpeace
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by liveinpeace » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:16 pm

i have just come in from work and have just laughed my head off at your post. i detest my neighbour but you have strangely made me feel somewhat lucky, as hes only a 7 on the bonkersometer.
i know i wouldn't be laughing if i lived next door to yours though.

why not suggest he puts up some netting to catch the fruit, made from organic biodegradable yak fur and sustainable coconut matting, of course.

or perhaps mention you have heard the government are considering fracking near by, this information is top secret as your nuclear physicists colleagues at the secret plant have told you not to tell anyone, but you thought he should know, and advise he gets himself down to the council offices as quickly as possible. this should take the heat off you for a while.

despair
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by despair » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:32 pm

Oh ...liveinpeace you are wicked

IdefixUK
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by IdefixUK » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:34 pm

It sounds to me as though your neighbour needs some professional help rather than humiliation, goading and teasing. I don't know how it could be done but perhaps a call to social services could start the ball rolling to be sure that he is receiving appropriate care. Perhaps other posters might know of the "correct" route.

Regards

despair
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by despair » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:55 pm

Sadly i dont think all the phone calls to appropriate teams in the world would help because the Mental Health Act means the person concerned has to agree to being assessed

I know several dementia patients who have enough brain left to refuse absolutely any assessment and thus their partners, neighbours etc are left to suffer the day in day out crazy behaviour

IdefixUK
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by IdefixUK » Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:06 pm

despair wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:55 pm
Sadly i dont think all the phone calls to appropriate teams in the world would help because the Mental Health Act means the person concerned has to agree to being assessed
With all due respect, despair, we don't know that this is the case here. Do we know that dementia is the diagnosis?

despair
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by despair » Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:02 pm

I was merely illustrating how the Mental Health Act apllies across all manner of illness


People with Vascular Dementia are in and out of dementia and thus on a Good day will absolutely refuse to be assesed or even accept they can no longer manage their affairs...this leaves their relatives in one hell of a pickle

We have no idea what kind of "madness " affects thin and crispys neighbour ...i just do not think any one would be able to get thriugh to him

mr sheen
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by mr sheen » Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:03 pm

The OP has described a person that s/he is in a dispute with from an individual subjective perspective. There is no objective data available.
It is not appropriate to digress to offensive comments about people with disabilities.
Recommending Mob humiliation may result in violent response. Diagnosing people from comments made by a poster is ridiculous and If the person is disabled, inciting action against them is not only offensive but may be a criminal offence.

If the OP is concerned about the behaviour of a neighbour, the options are - ignore it; move; take action if behaviour is actionable; call police if behaviour amounts to a criminal offence.

MacadamB53
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by MacadamB53 » Tue Oct 30, 2018 10:21 pm

Hi mr sheen,

I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment of your last post.

If the OP is concerned about the behaviour of a neighbour, the options are - ignore it; move; take action if behaviour is actionable; call police if behaviour amounts to a criminal offence.

I’d add “or, alternatively, raise those concerns with an appropriate professional service”

kind regards, Mac

ukmicky
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Re: Fallen leaves and fruit

Post by ukmicky » Wed Oct 31, 2018 12:16 am

The law is basically the fruit remains the property of your neighbour, even when it falls into your garden . That doesn't mean you have to do anything special for him though, you don't have to collect it for him.

So you have 2 options if your neighbour is an idiot .


Send him a letter inviting him round on a day of your choosing to collect the fallen fruit from your garden or you will dispose of them .

Send him a letter saying that if he wants his fruit back every year he must by --/--/-- day each year formally request a date from you that he can collect his fruit and that if he fails to do so you will dispose of the fruit or will allow it to rot where it falls. .
Any information provided is not legal advice and you are advised to gain a professional opinion

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