No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Conveyancer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by Conveyancer »

The point is this: if someone claims land or an easement either he has it or he does not. If he has it then saying he does not wish to pursue a claim for it does not deprive him of it since you can only transfer land or release an easement by deed.
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

Hi there Syckend
Many thanks for you kind note - the claimant is far from rich - he is, as you suggested, of no means at all.
I know he is struggling - I just thought that he may have given up, without telling us, so is the reason why
we sent the letter in the first place.

I had, in the latter part of 2011 written up a full witness statement in preparation for court should it arise,
and is riddled with faults, conjecture, possibly lies, as regards to the claimant. I am holding on to this for
the time being. Anyway, a letter was generated yesterday, but was better structured than the 1 march letter
in that in essence, I have stated that "as we have not heard from you, then we consider this issue closed,
and that your client no longer has a right to a false claim".

It was sent recorded delivery - I await with little anticipation as to what response there will be ??

Bit strong - but why not, litigation solicitors simply bully others into submission, so should work both ways.

So, my thanks to all those that have contributed - I may post a result if it is positive that may help others
in the near future

Best Regards
The ScatterEngineer.
The Scatter Engineer
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

Many thanks for the response - in fact you have helped in many ways, one is to
give me the confidence to continue on . . . so in that light, I have structured a
simple letter, but with one difference, it was posted on Monday afternoon 1430hrs
and was sent registered mail, to which the solicitors signed for on Tuesday (yesterday)
so I will wait and see....let you know the outcome.

Best Regards
The Scatterengineer.
The Scatter Engineer
<No such thing as problems, its solutions we are short of>
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

As regards mediation - we tried this late 2010 early 2011 cannot remember the dates, either way
the result was negative as the mediation team stated that until the boundary dispute is solved
they do not wish to get involved ???

regards
Scatterengineer
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enigma
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by enigma »

Do you think scatterengineer that you would want to sell your property before something happens to your neighbour? For example they die?
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

You are correct - my wife and I are of age, we would like to sell up and move out nearer
our Daughter and grandchildren. If anything happens to me, god forbid what my wife
has to put up with, in the manner of their behaviour next door. So, in a way, I am
duty bound to ensure the safety of my wife.

It is saturday 24 March - thus far, there has been no response. I am going to give it
until wednesday 28 March and if nothing is heard after first post on that day, I will
telephone a solicitor, its going to cost me £95 for 45minutes. I phoned around a few
solicitors, no one does this free 30 min that some other respondents have stated.

So, We will wait and see.

Regrds
The Scatterengineer.
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syckend
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by syckend »

All the best. You need closure. I know only too well how worrying it is to be trapped in a boundary dispute like this which is not of your making. Hopefully a strong letter will make your neighbour understand that he cannot continue making trouble over an unsustainable boundary line and that in the end he could lose everything. Fingers crossed.
I advise as an experienced layman whose dispute via Courts lasted 5+yrs. Try to avoid this route©
enigma
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by enigma »

£95 for 45 mins in the circumstances isn't bad. I think it depends on the grade of solicitor you engage. Before you go make sure you write everything down that needs to be said in that 45 mins. Don't wander off the subject when 45 mins might not be long enough.
I don't think you have said on this forum what the boundary dispute is exactly about. If you have and I have missed it could you briefly state what it is about.
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

Hi there enigma -
Mid 2010 received letter from claimant solicitor that we had encroached 1 foot and 2 inch.
In other words, we had taken their eavesdrop of their garage wall. There is a double garage
one belonging to the claimant, the other belonging to another neighbour, to which the rear wall
of double garage backs off on our driveway. Why after 20 years the claimant is complaining as
it has always been concreted up to, or paved up to the wall. All rainwater is drained off underground
to chalk and reclaimed. there are no soakaways on this entire estate of 90 houses that were built
in 1989.
We took advice from Chartered surveyor (court approved), he spent a couple of hours at our residence
and he clearly stated that our boundary line on the title (1:500) goes up to the double garage wall but
does not include it. But in the TP1 documentation, there is provision for rights of access to maintain
guttering, roof etc. Now my garage spans two rear gardens, and under the eavesdrop belongs to
the respective owners of those two properties, and provision is made for me to have access to maintain
my guttering and roofing should it be so desired.
In essence then, we submitted the surveyors report - it was refused as the claimant stated there was
no proof. Few weeks later, they decided to get their own Surveyor, they paid him to measure the
distance on the ground from the edge of my house to their garage wall, this measurment is 12Meter
They then compared it on the 1:500 title - which the title clearly states for information purposes only,
on on that title is 11meter. The claimants surveyor in his report states that "the assertion of the
claimant is correct in that the defendant has taken 1 meter of ground".

We then instructed a solicitor - and almost £8,000 later (including surveyors fees), which took it to
about the spring of 2011, we ended up in a situation where we were happy to allow the surveyors to
meet up on a non prejudicial basis and non binding in any way. Our surveyor asked several questions
regarding the meeting, the claimants surveyor would not answer, and we understand that the purpose
only of the meeting was to prove the 1 meter discrepancy, to which our surveyor was not interested in,
rather he wanted to discus the TP1 documentation, rights of access, the spanning our the defendants
garage in two gardens. Finally, the claimants solicitor clearly stated in a letter that the TP1 documentation
is in essence worthless - I put the nail in the coffin having taken advice, and clearly stated that the claim
was unfounded, unqualified, and had no substance, and that either stand down, or take to court.
Last correspondence I received (May 2011) stated that we would hear shortly as to court proceedings.
and heard nothing since.

We asked the neighbour who owns the other half of the double garage, and, also my garage is at the
bottom of his garden, and he agrees and is fully aware, that I own under the eavesdrop of his garage
that spans my drive, as he owns under the eavesdrop at the bottom of his garden.

wether you know this or not - 570million years ago life was created on this planet, it has taken 570 million
years for the human race to evolve to what it is today, its just a pity, some simply never listen and
accept sensible reasoning.

Best Regards
The Scatterengineer
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despair
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by despair »

Some posters do not like it when i say that :-

"bullies will never accept any facts /truth /etc put in front of them and in fact will even refuse to accept what a judge says "

Like it or not the kind of behaviour inc the hollow threats of court action you have experienced are very typical of a bully

Whatas inherently wrong is the value and saleability of your house is blighted by the actions of neighbours like yours
Sudynim
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by Sudynim »

despair wrote:Some posters do not like it when i say that :-

"bullies will never accept any facts /truth /etc put in front of them and in fact will even refuse to accept what a judge says "

Like it or not the kind of behaviour inc the hollow threats of court action you have experienced are very typical of a bully
The point is that you make these generalised, judgemental and contradictory statements willy-nilly, and without any real knowledge of the situations you are commenting upon. Basically you just jump in with both feet, and condemn the absent party (unless the poster asking for help is a council tenant or foreign).

Scatter's neighbour claims that 14" of land has been stolen from him, and he is attempting to recover that land. There's nothing wrong with him doing that, or with him attempting different ways to press his claim. Court action is one of the routes that you yourself repeatedly urge upon our visitors.

If Scatter's neighbour had posted here first, saying "I've had 14" of land stolen, and the culprit spent a fortune on lawyers and surveyors to intimidate me" then you would be cheerfully calling Scatter a bully now, and saying it was "typical" of bullies like Scatter that they try to force decent honest people to give up their land.
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scatterengineer
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by scatterengineer »

Herewith is the feedback that I hope others will find interesting and will learn from.

I saw a solicitor (or lawyer as I prefer to call the profession) spent around 1 hour, and in essence
the no response from a solicitor means absolutely nothing at all, even if you send your letter by
registered post and and proof of signature, it is to all intents and purposes a waste of time - unless
you get lucky and receive a response. But in essence, the fact that you get no reply does not mean
the dispute is closed, even if you put in the letter " if we do not hear from you in 14 days, we will
consider the issue closed" does not work either.

As someone pointed out, there are one of a few solutions, either, surveyors sort out the issue, by
proof of logical reasoning of the TP1 documentation (because there are no measured plans available any more),
or Court action, or mediation that is setup through a solicitor - in either event, they are all costly to some degree.

Use of the Land Registry Adjudicator can and possibly be usefull, I spent a large amount of time reading their
rules about adjudication, however, the most important part is that if the adjudicator needs to (and often does)
put the data set in front of a Judge, then, someone has to pay for it, in this case it would be me, and this most
certainly costs money up front, however, the claimant (as I am defendant) also has to put money up front as well,
to be clear on this, both parties have to put cash up front for the judges decision (this is my understanding thus far).

In my case, it seems (reasonable to assume) that as the local courts have not received any documentation
with respect to the dispute, then, the complainant possibly does not have the funds to see it through to
completion - or, the evidence they have may not support a claim. In either event, the complainant does not
have to drop the case, he/she can sit on it for ever and a year, but blights both properties for sale.

So, we are going nowhere at this time. One suggestion put forward was (from the lawyer), is that we could
put up our property for sale, but, we would have to declare that there is a dispute that has not been resolved.
Its possible that it may sell, however at a reduced price if someone is prepared to take on the headache of this
dispute. At this time, not sure about this suggestion, it does, for my wife and I gives us a chance to get out
but needs carefull thinking, planning of funds and the like. The only drawback is, if the property (new build)
comes up for grabs, and I cannot put a deposit on that new property, then we would have to back out of the
sale.

One think to bear in mind, the Property Information form that has to be filled in when you sell your property
does ask the question "have you been in dispute with your neighbour". I was assured by the (lawyer) or solicitor
that it is an extremely wide open question, it means any complaint that you and your neighbour has had, eg
parking your car, or their car, or dog fouling your garden, or cat jumping off your shed, or boundary dispute,
fencing issues, hedges not trimmed, you think of it, they want to know about it.

I hope this information is usefull to others who may come across the abovementioned Idea of closing it by
letter without a response.

I would like to take the opportunity to thank all those for their wealth of knowledge and feedback on this
issue, for that matter for keeping this site going.

Regards
ScatterEngineer
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Roblewis
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by Roblewis »

Equally though if you can get sign off at 14" of land then it may be an attractive proposition so as to be able to sell. The loss in value of a disputed house can be as high as 20-25% of market value so this needs to be put in the balance. Put up or shut up letters are not a guarantee but they can be useful in future actions as a judge may cause evidence to be estopped as it was not produced at an appropriate time on request. Nothing is certain in courts however. Your other alternative is slander of title as the threat of this should stir a response of some sort. The question is would you knowingly buy a property with this ongoing threat? Probably not and thus you are at your buyers mercy.
Fairperson
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by Fairperson »

One option is to volunteer a 'renegotiation of boundary' with your neighbour,
and for the newly agreed boundary to be registered & recorded in both property deeds.

If you decided to do this, I would suggest negotiating through your solicitor - representing you.
Your neighbour may or may not wish to have their solicitor represent them.

If the neighbour agrees to the process, you would need to find a good surveyor,
specialising in boundaries, to survey the current 'boundary' and boundary features, as are,
and to draw up a detailed plan.
Your solicitor, on your behalf, can then propose a boundary that you consider fair,
and can negotiate with your neighbour or their solicitor, until a boundary is mutually agreed.

Your solicitor can then communicate with land registry & complete the formalities.

When I did this, I chose to bear all costs - about £4500 (including surveyor fee of £1500, land reg. fee, & a mortage company fee for the other party) , the neighbour agreeing my first proposed boundary.

Although, you could offer your neighbour a 'renegotiation of boundary' on the basis of shared costs.

FP

Regrettably, I discovered in retrospect that my neighbour had no case to dispute the very longstanding boundary.
I wish I'd found Gardenlaw at that stage.
enigma
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Re: No response from solicitor means issue closed??

Post by enigma »

I must be the only one not to understand what is going on here. No response from solicitor or neighbour means the dispute is still there. What I cannot understand is this 14". Are you insisting on having it and if so why?
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