Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

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SwitchRich
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Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by SwitchRich » Mon May 15, 2017 12:59 pm

Hi Guys,
Quick question for you. I've spoke to a neighbour who owns a strip of land that runs across a small part of our back garden. It's probably 1m by 4m.
And I've said I would like to make an offer if he were willing to sell. And so far he said would definitely entertain the idea and will come back to me with a price.
It's not a game changer if it does not happen but I could use it to make a larger patio area and also store logs for the fire in winter time.

If he wants to sell, does the process have to involve lawyers on both sides with all the costs etc? Only I think I remember reading on here that it could be done without lawyers and we could update Land Registry ourselves. (Can't find the thread in question though) I guess the advantage here is I could make him a bigger offer if we saved on lawyers.

If anyone could shed any light on this I'd be very greatful! :)

Cheers


Rich

MacadamB53
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by MacadamB53 » Mon May 15, 2017 1:48 pm

Hi SwitchRich,

I've bought and sold registered land without using a sols - completing the HMLR forms myself - and found it all straightforward and simple enough.

never done it with unregistered, though, so no idea about that.

if you need help understanding the process I'd recommend you read the HMLR guides available online.

Kind regards, Mac

arborlad
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by arborlad » Mon May 15, 2017 3:49 pm

This should cover everything you need:
pilman wrote:Now that the outhouse is demolished what you are considering selling is additional land that can be used as part of the neighbour's garden.

The normal criteria is to calculate the additional value this land will add to the property whose owner wants to buy it.

So much depends on the area of land, where in England it is located, and the current value of residential property in that area. It also depends on the fact that you will no longer be able to access this land which may be of importance to the neighbour for reasons of privacy.

In 2002 a group of neighbours agreed to buy adjacent farm-land behind the residential properties from Bedfordshire County Council. We were quoted £25 per square metre, because the Council's land-agent calculated that each house plot would be worth that much more once this land was incorporated into the garden of each house.
In 2010 my friend asked to buy farm-land behind his house from Central Bedfordshire Council, after Beds C.C. had been disbanded. This quote was £50 per square metre.

It's now 2017 and land-prices have increased further, so it comes down to the age old question as to what a willing buyer and a willing seller will agree is the fair price of a small parcel of land.

The main thing is to ensure that all legal costs are the responsibility of the buyer, although if your property is registered with Land Registry it should be possible to agree a fixed sale price with no other costs involved, as long as you can complete the single form TP1 that can be downloaded from the Land Registry web-site.

Once your neighbour has seen a copy of the register of title for your property that proves legal ownership, then a signed TP1 form is the legal deed that transfers ownership of the land that will need to be identified on a simple plan with the dimensions of the plot being transferred written on that plan. You then hand the signed TP1 form over on receipt of the agreed price paid in cash, or by Bankers Draft, or by bank transfer.

That way there is no need for any legal fees if you and the neighbour are comfortable with that system, so you can ask a slightly higher selling price because there will be no need to employ a solicitor for either party.
The seller will then just need to print off an AP1 form from Land Registry's web-site and send a cheque and the TP1 to land Registry to have the land recorded in their ownership.
All that is explained on the LR web-site which means that a simple transfer of land can be undertaken by anyone capable of down-loading and printing forms and confirming the fee to be paid based on the value of the land being transferred. When that value is less than £6,000 there is no need to employ any solicitor nor to provide any proof of identity to Land Registry.

Should your property be unregistered then it is a matter for a solicitor to act for the buyer and probably for you as well. That is when the legal costs could be quite significant even for a small patch of land.
arborlad

smile...it confuses people

Collaborate
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by Collaborate » Mon May 15, 2017 6:39 pm

If your neighbour has a mortgage on their property they will need to instruct a solicitor on their lender's panel.

SwitchRich
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by SwitchRich » Mon May 15, 2017 10:42 pm

Thanks so much Mac, arborlad and Collaborate! So helpful of you :)
pilman gets some props too! :D
Neighbour has said he is retired so it might be he doesn't have a mortgage.
Will let you know how it goes.

Rich

pilman
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by pilman » Mon May 22, 2017 6:34 pm

You can confirm that neighbour's land is registered by looking on the Land Registry web-site?
then you can purchase the register of title and title plan for £6.
That will let you know if there is a mortgage company with a charge on the property.

You can let me know if you need any assistance, but the TP1 and AP1 forms are downloadable from LR web-site.
Can be completed on screen and then printed for signing and witnessing in the case of the TP1 which is the transfer deed for a Transfer of Part of a registered title.

"Simples" as the Meerkats say on TV, and they can't type as good as you do when you post on GardenLaw.

SwitchRich
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by SwitchRich » Wed Jun 07, 2017 10:44 am

Hey Guys, Is it me or have the Land Registry prices gone up?
I'm trying to buy my neighbours register and plan and it is saying the price is now £29.90?
I remember about a year ago this being £3 or so.
Am I going onto the wrong area of the website?
https://www.land-registry-deeds.co.uk/p ... e-register

MacadamB53
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by MacadamB53 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 10:50 am

SwitchRich wrote:Hey Guys, Is it me or have the Land Registry prices gone up?
I'm trying to buy my neighbours register and plan and it is saying the price is now £29.90?
I remember about a year ago this being £3 or so.
Am I going onto the wrong area of the website?
https://www.land-registry-deeds.co.uk/p ... e-register
that is a private, money-making website, not the HMLR website.

this is, though:

http://eservices.landregistry.gov.uk/wp ... rty_Search

arborlad
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by arborlad » Wed Jun 07, 2017 10:54 am

arborlad

smile...it confuses people

pilman
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by pilman » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:19 am

Arborlad you have to keep up to date, because Mac's posting used the web-page that immediately takes one to the start of a search.
The .Gov site is a step further back in the process which requires an extra "click" to get to the page Mac had already got to.

That's the equivalent to saying "a click in time saves two" :lol:

MacadamB53
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by MacadamB53 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:24 am

arborlad wrote:Wrong site - correct one: https://www.gov.uk/search-property-info ... d-registry
Hi arborlad,

clicking on the "Start Here" button on the webpage you've linked to takes the user to the page I linked to.

in other words, clicking on your link means the user has to navigate further to get to where they're wanting to go.

understand you're trying to help, though - not criticising.

Kind regards, Mac
edit: pilman, as ever, puts it better

arborlad
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by arborlad » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:41 am

I chose that section of the site because it contained this:


Fees
Document (each copy) Fee
Title summary (available from the new service) £3 (including VAT)
Title register £3
Title plan £3
Flood risk indicator £10.80 (including VAT)
arborlad

smile...it confuses people

SwitchRich
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by SwitchRich » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:39 pm

That's awesome! Thanks all :)
Thought it was expensive. Must be paying google a big bill to come up 1st in the list :D
Wonder who many people actually use them.

SwitchRich
Posts: 125
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2016 10:34 am

Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by SwitchRich » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:34 am

Dear Garden Law,

Just wanted to let you all know I am now the proud owner of a small strip of land I bought off my neighbour via the process described by pilman (referenced by arborlad in this thread) I purchased this strip (2 meters by 6 meters) by filling out the AP1 and TP1 forms and then sending direct to Land Registry.
Since the purchase price was below £6k we did not involve solicitors at all saving a ton of cash.

I have a few learnings to offer those who might wish to undertake this endeavor.

(1) Think about how you will pay. I gave my neighbour cash in return for the signed TP1 form. Whilst this is technically fine I did not ask for a receipt as I trusted the guy. But in future I would ask for one or send the cash via the internet as at least there is a solid record to prove payment.

(2) Ensure the deeds of the person you are buying from do not have any dead people still on it....
Yes this is real! After pilman kindly offered to take a look at my forms he pointed out that it appeared that my neighbour John (not his real name) still had has deceased parents on the deed. And they needed to be removed before this transaction could go ahead. I must admit I felt a bit exposed having passed over a wad of cash for a signed document that was technically invalid! Luckily John is a top bloke and I did all the forms for him to then sign to get his parents removed from the deed.

(3) Ensure if the is John's full name on the deed is "John Charles Jackson" That his signature should read John Charles Jackson... and not John Jackson... As Land Registry will send that right back asking to confirm that these two individuals are one and the same...

Luckily all has ended well and thanks to this wonderful little website I now can transform my garden into something a bit special I hope.

pilman you are a legend thank you so much for all you help mate! :)
Plus all the contributors that are so helpful to me and others just because they enjoy being helpful! Altruism at its best :)


Cheers


Rich

pilman
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Re: Buying a small strip of land from a neighbour

Post by pilman » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:28 pm

9 Consideration
The transferor has received from the transferee for the property the following sum (in words and figures):
Glad to hear that all went well for SwitchRich, although I think the comments made may not be accurate.

The quote above is from the printed section 9 of the TP1 form used to transfer part of an existing registered property.

That is a receipt for the money paid, the amount of which which has to be entered on the line below that statement.
The signature of the Transferor at the end of the form confirms that fact, because no one is likely to sign the transfer of the land unless they have received the money stated in section 9.

As for signing a deed, I have never ever signed other than with my first initial and then my surname since buying my first property in 1964 and subsequently buying and selling various parcels of land since that date.
I have also seen hundreds of deeds signed and very few use all of the forenames of the signatories.

Not sure why Land Registry queried a person's normal signature? I've not heard of that before.

It is a fact that if more than one name appears on the current register of title then all of those named will need to sign the transfer deed.

Changing the names when someone dies is necessary, as it changing the addresses of the owners if they move from the address first recorded by Land Registry.
That is just a matter of administration when one owns property with other people.
That's why the current Official copy of a register of title should provide all the information needed when dealing with the owner or owners of registered land.

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