Inserting a Door on a Right of way

xamanuk
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Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:10 pm

Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by xamanuk » Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:27 am

Hello All,

I was wondering if anyone was able to help on the below.

My mother in law lives in a cul de sac area and she shares a right of way with 2 other houses which runs from the side of the neighbors house to the back of her house (as shown in blue).

The problem arises as person in house D (which has no right of way and lives on a different street) has build an extension at the back of his house and has inserted a door (shaded in black), which gives him access to the right of way (i.e I believe he plans to rent the place but he said its only a "gym").

Checked title deeds - Person D doesn't have "right of way"

Also the right of way was previously pebble stones but person in house D has concreted it.

I have phoned the council and they have said that it has nothing to do with them.

Mother in Law has discussed with neighbors and now plans to insert a gate at the start of the right of way so no access is given to person in house D, which seems reasonable.

Is there anything else that can be done.

A - Mother in law house
B - Neighbor
C - Neighbor
D - Build an extension
Blue line - right of way
Black line - Door onto the right of way
Red box - Extension

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks
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span
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by span » Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:45 am

Who actually owns the land the ROW runs over? Does A, B and C each own a portion of it? Does either A, B or C own the entire lot of it? Does some other person or entity - council, developer etc -(hey, let's call this hypothetical person "E") own the land?

xamanuk
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by xamanuk » Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:04 am

A, B and C each own a portion of it.

arborlad
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by arborlad » Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:08 am

xamanuk wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:27 am

Also the right of way was previously pebble stones but person in house D has concreted it.


The whole of it?............ that's a lot of concrete.

Have you drawn the extension 50% larger than it actually is?
arborlad

smile...it confuses people

xamanuk
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by xamanuk » Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:53 am

Person D owns both the house and thus has the extension over both gardens

span
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by span » Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:05 pm

xamanuk wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 11:04 am
A, B and C each own a portion of it.
From the photo it seems he's only accessing C''s land.

Are you C?

C can tell him to clear off. Or block off his gate.

What on earth was he thinking, resurfacing in concrete land he doesn't own nor have a ROW over? Be sure to thank him nicely for that though.

arborlad
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by arborlad » Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:09 pm

xamanuk wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:27 am

Mother in Law has discussed with neighbors and now plans to insert a gate at the start of the right of way so no access is given to person in house D, which seems reasonable.


Rather than the additional expense and additional inconvenience for all the legitimate users of the ROW, I would place a sturdy barrier in front of Ds gate, short term this could be a section of Herras and if either A B or C knows someone in construction it could be placed within the hour.

Expect some backlash and retaliation.

D could of course purchase some rights from A B and C for a very substantial sum...............
arborlad

smile...it confuses people

IdefixUK
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by IdefixUK » Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:19 pm

Hello,
It looks from the photo that D's rear garden is twice as wide as that of some of the neighbouring gardens, is this correct? If so then there is plenty of space for another dwelling (or more) on that land and this may well be the goal of the owner of D. It would make sense to download the deeds of D's property so that you are quite sure that there is no expressed right to benefit D (and perhaps look at the property next to D that D seems to have the garden from) . It does seem from your diagram that the gym extends onto another property,is this correct?
If D doesn't benefit from any expressed (written) rights across the path, then is the path wide enough to erect a single 6ft fence panel blocking the doorway to D without causing a problem for the legitimate users? Any posts would need to be on the land of the path and not attached to D's property. Taking this action would make it abundantly clear to D that you intend preventing access from his property across the pathway. If he objects to this then it is up to him to prove that a right exists. If he can prove a right (eg by prescription) then you have only wasted the price of a fence panel and a couple of posts. Beware that if D or the owners before him have used the path with some regularity for access without permission,without secrecy and without force, for a period of twenty years then a right may have developed. Once the right exists you have to accept that it is there for ever. Was there a fence or wall between D and the path before the gym was built? You would do well to look into the history of these properties to find out if years ago the land that is now the pathway and D were under the same ownership and when.
Suggest that you take lots of photos as you go along.

Regards

despair
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by despair » Fri Oct 26, 2018 12:35 pm

If he has built an extention slam up to the ROW pathway surely he has dug up the pathway for overspill of foundations
Did all 3 ROW users ignore this intrusion

xamanuk
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Joined: Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:10 pm

Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by xamanuk » Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:31 pm

Hello all,

Much appreciated with the responses.

It looks from the photo that D's rear garden is twice as wide as that of some of the neighbouring gardens, is this correct? -

Yes. I believe he owns the 3 properties which are next to each other. He rents one which has a very small garden and he has taken that garden. The extension is quite big which could house a family. i believe this is the reason he has inserted a door at the back. People can access the extension from the right of way rather then go through his garden.
I have download his deed and their is no express right to benefit or anything else.

Looks like a fence might be erected in front of his door.

arborlad
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by arborlad » Fri Oct 26, 2018 2:06 pm

xamanuk wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:27 am

Also the right of way was previously pebble stones but person in house D has concreted it.


When was the concreting done?
arborlad

smile...it confuses people

despair
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by despair » Fri Oct 26, 2018 2:34 pm

Will he then simply open up another door furthur along ?

He sounds like a budding property developer with deep pockets

Have all 3 of you got legalexpenses cover on your house insurances because you might need it

IdefixUK
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by IdefixUK » Fri Oct 26, 2018 2:53 pm

xamanuk wrote:
Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:31 pm

Yes. I believe he owns the 3 properties which are next to each other. He rents one which has a very small garden and he has taken that garden. The extension is quite big which could house a family. i believe this is the reason he has inserted a door at the back. People can access the extension from the right of way rather then go through his garden.
I have download his deed and their is no express right to benefit or anything else.
My advice is that you download deeds for any of these properties which abut the pathway. Do not forget the deeds of the house with the shortened garden as the apparent change of garden area might not be registered with Land Reg. Even if there is an easement from one of those properties in does not follow that use of that ROW can be used to benefit the adjoining properties (unless the use of the non-benefitting land can be considered ancillary to the use of the land which does have the benefit).

SwitchRich
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by SwitchRich » Fri Oct 26, 2018 3:21 pm

Would it be possible to get some photos of this extension and gate that has been put in?

Also do you have any photos of the ROW previous to this extension? That would prove a timeline as to when this gate was put in. And possible quelle any chances of him claiming a ROW by prescription.

And do keep it in the back of your mind as aborlad pointed out. This could be worth something for him!! If you were OK with a person who might live in this new extension using this access way, then doing a deal based on a payment form him to create an easement could be worthwhile.??

Collaborate
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Re: Inserting a Door on a Right of way

Post by Collaborate » Fri Oct 26, 2018 6:57 pm

I don't think OP's mother-in-law's property will be involved in the sale of any new ROW - MrD would not need to enter the path immediately behind her property.

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