Amenity land.

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Re: Amenity land.

Postby arborlad » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:39 am

mugwump wrote:Attorney-General v Beynon [1970] Ch 1.

The “hedge to hedge” presumption is that a highway extends to the whole width of the space between fences on either side of the highway and is not limited to the metalled part of the roadway. The hedge is presumed to belong to the adjacent landowner





The full article is a useful read: http://www.titleandcovenant.co.uk/pdfs/ ... letter.pdf
arborlad

smile...it confuses people
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jdfi » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:28 pm

jonahinoz wrote:Hi,

Is there a legal definition of AMENITY LAND , in statute or case law?

The impression I have is that it is land for everyone to enjoy ... except the owner.

John W


Is it not simply land that everyone can access but where there is no documented right of access?
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:57 am

The full article is a useful read: http://www.titleandcovenant.co.uk/pdfs/ ... letter.pdf

Hi Arborland,

Thanks for that link. Yes, it was interesting reading, but doesn't answer my question. The case quoted referred to Vehicle Excise Duty, not property ownership. However, it does seem to suggest that amenity land is a highway, assuming it goes somewhere ... Is it possible to pass and re-pass to nowhere ... which does answer some of my concerns. Amenity land would appear to be a ROW for everybody, with or without animals or vehicles, at all times. In effect a public ROW that has not been adopted, possibly because it does not meet the specification required to be adopted.

It also suggests that a visibility splay becomes part of the highway.

Still confusing, as it is an endorsable offence to drive onto privately owned land, without authority, except for the purpose of parking, and that for no more than 15 yards (or is it metres now?) I'm guessing that's in CROW 1992. It is also an endorsable offence to drive an HGV onto privately owned land, without authority ... with no exception for parking. The owner of the land can authorise driving on his land, as can a police officer (I think).

The VED ruling, above, referred to a "highway repairable at public expense". The amenity land behind my daughter's house, and the possible amenity land in front of "my" bungalow, are both mowed by the LA. I do not know what authority they have to mow this land. ??? Can my daughter tell them to stop mowing her land? Does the fact that the LA do "repair" her land make it "repairable at public expense"?

Further along the road from "my" bungalow, the houses have hard standing between the front of the houses and the footpath. There is no physical barrier between the hard standing and the footpath. The cars park with their bumpers against the house wall. Millions of other houses have a covenant preventing their front gardens being fenced. According to the hedge to hedge rule, the visibility splays, hard standings, and front gardens, are part of the highway, and the whole world and his brother being entitled to pass and repass, with animals or vehicles, at all times, without hindrance. Does parking your car in your front garden count as hindrance? And what about the gnome? :roll: Is this a can of worms waiting to be opened?

The front gardens and hard standing are not repairable at public expense, I'm not sure about the visibilty displays.

All I want to know is, assuming the grass strip in front of "my" bungalow is "my" amenity land, may I use it as a winding hole, when exiting my drive? Occasional parking by visiting friends would be useful.

Interestingly, I learned yesterday that a mate in the Land Rover club does a lot of contract work for the council. He is investigating.

John W (Not the only one with amenity land problems)
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:48 pm

Hi,

I have spent several hours trying to get a copy of the LR site plan, to no avail. I can get onto the site, tell them the address of the property, and then they ask me to identify it on a street map. I can place the circle over where the property, but not lock it there. I was born before WW2, and am not fluent in Geek. I cannot get out of the loop.

I phoned Land Registry, spoke to a nice lady with a Welsh accent. Yes, she was in Swansea. I told her I once worked at DVLA (probably before she was born). She said she had worked there too. Small world.

She checked her map, agreed that the house I was looking for was where I said it was, and gave me the Register Number.

Back to the LR web-site ... I couldn't find anywhere to search by the Register number.

I think my dog is due for a kicking.

John W
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jdfi » Mon Jan 29, 2018 7:49 pm

jonahinoz wrote:Hi,

I have spent several hours trying to get a copy of the LR site plan, to no avail. I can get onto the site, tell them the address of the property, and then they ask me to identify it on a street map. I can place the circle over where the property, but not lock it there. I was born before WW2, and am not fluent in Geek. I cannot get out of the loop.

I phoned Land Registry, spoke to a nice lady with a Welsh accent. Yes, she was in Swansea. I told her I once worked at DVLA (probably before she was born). She said she had worked there too. Small world.

She checked her map, agreed that the house I was looking for was where I said it was, and gave me the Register Number.

Back to the LR web-site ... I couldn't find anywhere to search by the Register number.

I think my dog is due for a kicking.

John W


If you're still struggling then I have the professional system, if you wanted me to send you the file and you transfer me £3.
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:24 am

If you're still struggling then I have the professional system, if you wanted me to send you the file and you transfer me £3.

Hi JDFI,

Thankyou for the offer, most generous.

An E-mate on the Land Rover Club forum made the same offer last night. I have just checked. He emailed me copies at 08.44hrs. They have not yet arrived. It's now 09.20hrs. I'll give them a little longer, then maybe come back to you.

Thankyou again,

John W (Been playing PC since 05.00. SWMBO says it's time to get out of my jim-jams, and walk the dog. No sense of timing, that woman. :roll: )
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:28 pm

Hi JDFI,

The documents arrived from my Land Rover E-mate, at the second attempt, but thank you for your offer.

The red boundary round the property does not include the grass strip.

Apparently the original "deeds" had been lost prior to 2000, but covenants from before that date are still enforcable.

More covenant(s) were added when the property was last sold in 2004.

A "right" was given by Deed of Grant, by the LA. I think in also in 2004 ... I can only look at one thing at a time on my screen.

There is no indication given about what the covenants and grant relate to, but the Register ends with "Note - copies filed"
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Wed Jan 31, 2018 6:48 pm

Hi everybody,

End of story. The bungalow was sold this afternoon, although the estate agent did not say if that was SSTC.

Thank you, everybody for your interest.

Right! Plan B .....

John W
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jdfi » Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:10 am

jonahinoz wrote:Hi everybody,

End of story. The bungalow was sold this afternoon, although the estate agent did not say if that was SSTC.

Thank you, everybody for your interest.

Right! Plan B .....

John W


There will be another..... £3 wasted though :(
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Mon Feb 05, 2018 6:59 pm

There will be another..... £3 wasted though

Hi JDFI,

True! We have already identified Plan.B. Another bungalow, 3-bed this time, bath and seperate shower, but only one WC (We have reached that age), comfotable parking for three cars on forecourt, full width dropped kerb, plus a sort of garage (not sure about it's construction), same price as the other, and much nicer. But we are still sweating on getting an offer of our present house ... two viewings last week, one tomorrow, and another on Saturday. Fingers crossed.

I have a couple of other questions about this one, but lets wait till something is done and dusted.

John W
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:57 pm

There will be another..... £3 wasted though

Hi IDFI,

Three times I gave details of my credit card, never got as far as having a document I could download. But not a problem, it seemed to say that payment would not be taken until the document was downloaded.

Today, my credit card statement arrived. It seems I have paid Land Registry £3. I wonder if the other two lots of £3 will be on next months statement/

I can feel a crusade coming over me.

John W
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jdfi » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:23 am

jonahinoz wrote:There will be another..... £3 wasted though

Hi IDFI,

Three times I gave details of my credit card, never got as far as having a document I could download. But not a problem, it seemed to say that payment would not be taken until the document was downloaded.

Today, my credit card statement arrived. It seems I have paid Land Registry £3. I wonder if the other two lots of £3 will be on next months statement/

I can feel a crusade coming over me.

John W


From memory, Land Registry say in their terms that they will provide a refund provided a document hasn't been downloaded or viewed.

I would check with your credit card company and then, armed with all information, phone LR.
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Re: Amenity land.

Postby jonahinoz » Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:05 pm

Hi JDFI,

I have informed my card company, who have raised a dispute. I think that means they have cancelled the payment, and are waiting for LR to squark.

My hearing aids (£2,000) are intermittant in quality of reception when I'm on the phone ... it can change in mid conversation. I prefer to let SWMBO deal with men in suits on the phone. But first I have to explain the problen to her, often when I can't explain it to nyself.

OT ... a singing kettle sounds like a TSR2 switching on it's after burners, and A "tinkle" sounds like the Niagra Falls filling a bucket

I'll let you know what happens with LR.

John W
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