The next time moonbeam experiences the joshing that goes on between members of a family, or among colleagues, or a group of friends, I do hope he/she doesn't go at them along the lines of "how dare you?"
Perhaps some of the work of writers through the ages - everyone from Shakespeare to Bill Bryson - should be read to see just how long mickey-taking has been going on and is still quite rightly called literature.
You might also want to read the pages of jokes in the General section (all of which, in essence, "mock" someone) and then reassess your indignation. Just my opinion - others have every right to disagree.
Having said that, if you are really a believer, then I'm sorry that you found my account of Biodynamics troublesome. Clearly, if you feel it necessary to contact the Biodynamic Society of England and Wales, that's your prerogative - but I doubt they'll be able to explain it any more sensibly than I have.
Thanks for your comments Paddy's Mum. As you obviously appreciate, my post wasn't entirely innocent fun. Behind the humour and silliness were a few serious points about cultism; denial of responsibility, and uncritical, sheep-like behaviour.
Just in case anyone is inclined to take offence, I should emphasize that I didn't set out to ridicule all of the things this thread has touched upon. Many of them, of course, have real and tangible benefits. Yoga has obvious physical and psychological benefits. Sensible environmentalism is crucial in the modern world. Paganism is a core ancestral belief. Spam is a reconstituted meat product.
It's just Biodynamic Gardening that I have trouble with.
I can't see any realistic foundation for it. What, for example, are these mystical energies we read so much about? How does the Moon focus them? Is the stirring a homeopathic process? Does barometric pressure change when the Earth breathes out?
This is where we need the voice of experience, so I wondered whether a practitioner from "the other side" would like to contribute to the discussion. Perhaps a member of the Biodynamic Society would be able to answer any questions which we newcomers might have; or maybe we could have a debate into the rationale and science behind Biodynamics ... or is that just me being silly again?
Anyone who takes this utter nonsense seriously needs to keep the fact to themselves or risk the ridicule it so richly deserves.
I haven’t heard such unfounded unscientific twaddle since the advent of the feng shui (spelling) consultant.
i think think and crispy should write a book - very clever - very witty and yet still getting across important issues (i for one think spam should be eliminated from the food chain)
onward and upward i say
What can I say?
With regard to Ned's suggestion, I am actually planning a new book at the moment, so I hope you don't mind me giving it a plug. It's a serious socio-political study of the Natural Law Party, entitled "Yogic Flying - The most fun you can have with your legs crossed".
I have yet to find a publisher, but your most generous comments will spur me on.
It is very easy to riducule things that you know nothing about. Perhaps you would like to explain to every one why the bio-dynamic practices work? If as I suspect you cannot, then you should prove to everyone that they do not work. You cannot prove this for many good reasons :-
Rudalf Steiner was a man with much greater spiritual understanding than you can ever imagine and you should not try to ridicule him. His insight and teachings reach far beyond what you call science. Bio-dynamics is based on ancient farming practces which have worked over many thousands of years. Rudalf Steiner formulated bio-dynamics after studying and experiencing pagan and druid religions and others, thinking about philosphy. He was a great man. He was a genius which you will never understand.
The bio-dynamic preps have been used successfully for thousands of years. Moreover it is at one with our spiritual world and is for the benefit of all human beings. You cannot hope to divorce farming from nature as is happening now. Furthermore it is scientifically verified but not in the way close minded people like you would understand.
We get better crop yields (verified). We get better soil structure (verified). We get healthier and delicious food (verified). You should acknowledge that at least.
Before you ridicule things which you have not any knowledge you should be sure you understand those things.
We do not make silly jokes about weed killer and insecticide poisons. Please do not make silly jokes about the bio-dynamic preparations.
I know many people who laugh like mad when the subject of water divining crops up, and say it is a load of bunkum. I thought so too until, as a young woman, I found that I could do it. I don't know how it works, I just know from my own experience that it does.
Equally, I have experienced strong and very unsettling premonitions which have turned out to be true to subsequent events. Who can prove any of it to another?
However, the reality of thin and crispy's post was to take the mickey, not to harm or damage another person. You seem to have missed the humour and taken the words as a personal affront, while I am certain that no such offence was intended.
I can turn on my radio and from all over the world come statements from diverse people/groups. Many hold and express beliefs which I cannot accept, particularly such things as 'the one true God' or women in purdah. However, there is still the possibility of humour to be found in there as one or two of the jokes in another thread will show. Think of the joke by zaman which got a laugh out of a suicide in a lunatic asylum, or Will Remain Strong's joke about the potential rape of a nun or Conveyancer's joke note to the milkman which got a laugh out of stuffy, verbose, twisted logic lawyer speak.
I think that perhaps you need to lighten up and realise that mild ridicule is often highly amusing and of benefit to people having a hard time in life. It is not an accident that many languages have an expression that translates exactly to our own 'laughter is the best medicine'.
Your beliefs have, in my opinion, been leavened with a little bit of humour not hatred or contempt and that is why I found the original post very funny and in no sense cruel ... and as it happens, I do know a joke about weedkiller.
A rather stupid wife told her marriage guidance counsellor that the marital rift had been repaired and when asked to indicate on what she based that assessment replied "well, you see, I'm an animal lover and my hubby says he's gonna buy me a para cat for my next birthday". (Paraquat - get it? Well, you did ask
Walks off stage left muttering quietly "I must engage brain before opening mouth....must engage brain ......!)
As Paddy's Mum rightly observes, my intention wasn't to cause personal offence. Having said that, there are serious points behind the humour; and I accept that some people might not agree with my opinion.
You're also right Mudlark, I do find the "philosophy" behind Biodynamics distasteful, but not entirely for the reasons that I've alluded to. (I think a serious discussion of Biodynamics and "Steinerism" - which I might touch on later if anyone is interested - would shock and worry many people.) However, what I've said so far is all just a personal, light-hearted view, so I really don't think it's obligatory for you take so much offence Moonbeam.
Neither do I think it's logical for you to ask me to disprove your claim that Biodynamic practices work. Can you disprove the "fact" that a pig just flew over my rhubarb patch?
If, as you say, the benefits of Biodynamic agriculture have been scientifically verified, it shouldn't be too difficult for practitioners to cite properly conducted, peer-reviewed, independent research. The only supportive research I have found originates from institutions that have a very obvious Anthroposophical axe to grind.
I'm not, in any sense, against nature, farming or the environment. (Quite the reverse in fact.) I just don't believe that there is anything mystical about it. An enquiring, scientific outlook reveals every aspect of nature to be far more wondrous than it could ever seem from a foggy-brained, New Age standpoint. If we don't understand something, the rational approach is to investigate it scientifically, not to assume it's some sort of spiritual magic.
As far as weed killer is concerned, please feel free to crack as many jokes as you want. I promise I'll take it all on the chin.